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Thread: Urdu-Hindi: hone tak/hote tak

  1. #1
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    Urdu-Hindi: hone tak/hote tak

    By all accounts, one of Ghalib's famous Ghazals with the refrain (radiif) "hone tak" was actually "hote tak"! But, for whatever reason, over a period of time the "hote tak" got transformed to "hone tak".

    aah ko chaahiye ik 'umr, asar hote/hone tak
    kaun jiitaa hai, tirii zulf ke sar hote/hone tak

    .....

    ham ne maanaa kih taGhaaful nah karo ge, lekin
    Khaak ho jaa'eN ge ham, tum ko Khabar hote/hone tak

    How do you think "hote tak" differs from "hone tak"?

  2. #2
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    Re: Urdu-Hindi: hone tak/hote tak

    Quote Originally Posted by QURESHPOR View Post

    By all accounts, one of Ghalib's famous Ghazals with the refrain (radiif) "hone tak" was actually "hote tak"! But, for whatever reason, over a period of time the "hote tak" got transformed to "hone tak".

    aah ko chaahiye ik 'umr, asar hote/hone tak
    kaun jiitaa hai, tirii zulf ke sar hote/hone tak

    .....

    ham ne maanaa kih taGhaaful nah karo ge, lekin
    Khaak ho jaa'eN ge ham, tum ko Khabar hote/hone tak

    How do you think "hote tak" differs from "hone tak"?
    Well, in spelling for a start !

    But jesting aside, the two are very close - in fact, too close for me to actually try expalin the difference here. I don't think you get a change of meaning if you use either and that is all that is important.



    BTW, what makes you say this!
    Utlub al-‘ilm min al-mahd ilal-laHd Seek knowledge from the cradle to the grave (Ali ibn Abi Talib)

  3. #3
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    Re: Urdu-Hindi: hone tak/hote tak

    Quote Originally Posted by Faylasoof View Post
    Well, in spelling for a start !

    But jesting aside, the two are very close - in fact, too close for me to actually try expalin the difference here. I don't think you get a change of meaning if you use either and that is all that is important.

    BTW, what makes you say this!
    Please allow me to clarify my way of perceiving this difference. It would help me if used..

    sham' har rang meN jaltii hai
    saHar hone tak

    To my mind, "hone tak" conveys a "point" in time. As if one moment it is still night time and the next moment it is dawn! But dawn has a begining and an end and there is therefore a period of time enveloping dawn and this is described by using "hote tak", which in essence means "hote hote".

    sham' har rang meN jaltii hai saHar hote tak

    sham' har rang meN jaltii hai saHar hote hote

    In other words, end of the night is the begining of dawn, which is the "source". End of dawn is the "goal". The time gap between the source and the goal is the time "path". hote describes the path.



  4. #4
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    Re: Urdu-Hindi: hone tak/hote tak

    An interesting example from Hali's "muqaddimah".

    "jis zamaanah meN Miir ne yih masnaviyaaN likhii haiN us vaqt Urdu zabaan par faarsiyyat bahut Ghaalib thii aur masnavii kaa ko'ii namuunah Urdu zabaan meN Ghaalib-an maujuud nah thaa aur agar ek-aadh namuunah maujuud bhii ho to us se chandaaN madad mil nahiiN saktii. is ke sivaa agarchih Ghazal kii zabaan bahut manjh ga'i thii magar masnavii kaa rastah saaf hote tak abhii bahut zamaanah dar-kaar thaa.."

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