أ - ؤ - ئ

Discussion in 'العربية (Arabic)' started by Anatoli, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. Anatoli Senior Member

    Melbourne, Australia
    Native: русский (Russian), home country: English
    I hope this within the topic but even reading the textbooks and the threads in this forums, I haven't found the rules on how to read letters ئ ؤ أ in the middle of a word. The rules on when to write these letters are complex enough but I'm interested if there are definite rules on how to read them.

    Can they be read as 'a, 'u, 'i or a', u', i' or a'a, a'u and a'i and other combinations? The last set shows that you just need to know the short vowel of the preceding consonant but the vowel following the glottal stop will be determined by the letter carrying it?

    --
    Also, is there more than one version of letter ئ ? With hamza sitting on the left and on the right corner?
     
  2. Whodunit

    Whodunit Senior Member

    กรุงเทพมหานคร
    Deutschland ~ Deutsch/Sächsisch
    I don't understand you second question, but as for the first one: The glottal stop is always pronounced before the letter carrying it. أ = 'a, ؤ = 'u, and ئ = 'i. Other pronunciations (the last combination you suggested) are coincidences, where a vowel precedes the hamza:

    qara2a = قرأ (vowel 'a' above the 'r')
    ya2iisa = يئس (vowel 'a' above the 'y')

    An exception might be the words where the hamza is the last sound before a consonant:

    ra2s = رأس

    I don't think رءس would be pronounced differently, but it just looks ugly. :)

    If the hamza should be pronounced after a vowel, it has to stand alone or must be put on the next vowel, if possible:

    Sa7raa2 = صحراء
    sau2a = سوءة
    BUT:

    ru2uus = رؤوس

    The vowel before the hamza is a , therefore you need a waw as a hamza carrier. A long [uu] sound follows, that's why a normal waw must be written.

    Only the four typical ones depending on where they are found:

    ئ - isolated
    ئـ - at the beginning
    ـئـ - in the middle
    ـئ - at the end
     
  3. Anatoli Senior Member

    Melbourne, Australia
    Native: русский (Russian), home country: English
    Thanks Whodunit. Can the be any vowel in front of a hamza carrying letter?

    Are there a lot of exceptions like this?


    This example would be really confusing thanks for explaining. I found the words with letters carrying hamza hard to read even if the full vowels were provided because I was never sure where to position the hamza, so I searched for a romanisation of some of those words.


    I think I am clearer now, thanks a lot :)
     
  4. Whodunit

    Whodunit Senior Member

    กรุงเทพมหานคร
    Deutschland ~ Deutsch/Sächsisch
    I assume by "vowel" you mean "long vowel" or "vowel letter" (ا، و، ي). The only word that comes to my mind is:

    3aa2iq (plural: 3awaa2iq) - (عائق (عوائق

    Tell me the exact date when you'll have been able to pronounce it perfectly. :D

    Not that I know of. Some exceptions are normal in any languages, many or a lot of exceptions would form a new rule. ;)

    Hamzaat are always very confusing (their declensions and conjugations, for instance) even for native speakers and advanced learners of Arabic.

    I'm glad my reply has helped you. :)
     
  5. Anatoli Senior Member

    Melbourne, Australia
    Native: русский (Russian), home country: English
    Here's an example of a word I wasn't sure how to read:

    مؤتمر (mu'tamar) - conference. (' = the glottal stop)

    It had vowels written on it (the initial م has a damma and there's a sukuun over ؤ) but no transliteration, remembering that the glottal stop precedes the vowel I got confused. Must be another exception - letters with a hamza and a sukun?
     
  6. Whodunit

    Whodunit Senior Member

    กรุงเทพมหานคร
    Deutschland ~ Deutsch/Sächsisch
    The fully vowelized version would be

    مُؤْتَمَرٌ - mu2tamarun.

    Yes, I think it is another exception, where the wawu 't-hamza (does this term exist?) gets a sukuun.
     
  7. Anatoli Senior Member

    Melbourne, Australia
    Native: русский (Russian), home country: English
    Exceptions, exceptions...

    شَأْنٌ

    sha'nun - affair, matter

    I think the letters with hamza, like any other letter can carry a sukuun in the middle of a word, if previous consonants have a short vowel, otherwise (after a long vowel) it would be a hamza (with a sukuun) on its own.

    (I am only talking about a glottal stop when not followed by a vowel.)


     
  8. Josh_ Senior Member

    the phrontistery
    U.S., English
    I think you guys are making it more complicated than it has to be. It seems to me, since hamza is a letter, that the pronunciation follows the standard pronunciation for the respective اوزان (patterns), and has little to do with the letter carrying it. The letter carrying it is has to do with hamza's position in a word and the surrounding letter/pronunciation scheme. It may be a coincidence that that most of the time hamza is pronounced before the letter carrying it, but it doesn't seem like it would be a rule as there are many examples of hamza pronounced after the letter carrying it.

    Examples of the patterns:

    رؤوس = فُعول
    compare تيوس (billy goats)
    ru2uus, tuyuus

    رأس وشأن = فَعْل
    compare دقن (chin)
    ra2s, sha2n, daqn

    مؤتمر = مُفتَعَل
    compare معتقد (believed)
    mu2tamar, mu3taqad

    ِ
    These rules are not as complex as they seem at first if you remember the rule of precedence, or as I like to call it the trump rule:). Like I said above, these rules are based on the position of hamza in a word and the surrounding letters. Here are two threads dealing with the spelling:

    http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=159114

    http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=43789
     

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