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مونوغرافية المقدس [...] ودراسة آليات اشتغال الكتابة

Discussion in 'العربية (Arabic)' started by César Lasso, Jul 2, 2013.

  1. César Lasso Senior Member

    Madrid (España)
    castellano, España
    Hello!

    I'm volunteering to help a Spanish library specialized in Andalusian and Arabic books. I'm in the heart of al-Andalus, bi-madeenati QurTuba!!!

    Could you please help me with the translation of the following title?

    Mūnūghrāfiyyat al-muqaddas bi-madīnati Miknās : Muqāraba li-ȥāhira al-awliyā fī tağliyati-hā al-thaqafiyya wa-l-adabiyya wa-dirāsat alyāq ishtighāl al-kitāba

    Of course, I transliterated the title (for the book record) and there could be a mistake in my transliteration (especially in my transliteration of "alyāq"). It was really written as follows:

    آلياق

    (please don't laugh at my attempt of a Spanish translation. In English, it would be something as the following):

    A Monography of the Holy in the City of Meknes : An approach to the group of holy men in its cultural and literary aspects, and a study on (???) the use of writing.

    Sa-ashkurukum 3alà ayyi musaa3ada!

    :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2013
  2. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English
    Are you sure of this word? Could it be آليات (mechanisms)?
     
  3. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    No it's ألياق, as in the accepted practices or professional standards or conventions.
    And اشتغال الكتابة is the profession of writing.
    i'm not sure what مقاربة لظاهر الأولياء means but can ask someone who might know better than me.
     
  4. César Lasso Senior Member

    Madrid (España)
    castellano, España
    Thanks a lot for that and any possible further help!

    :)
     
  5. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English
    I found this on Google books:
    مونوغرافية المقدس بمدينة مكناس: مقاربة لظاهرة الأولياء في تجلياتها الثقافية والأدبية ودراسة آليلت اشتغال الكتابة
    I think there is a typo and آليلت should be آليات


    I'd change the transliteration to make it more standard:
    I'd make some changes to the translation:
     
  6. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    al-muqaddas = the shrine. Otherwise, thumbs up to Andy's version.
     
  7. akhooha Senior Member

    English - USA
  8. GoldBug

    GoldBug Senior Member

    Great Lakes area - USA
    American English
    Mūnūghrāfiyat ?

    Is this plural?

    In any case, the English translation is incorrect (I also think the Arabic is incorrect most likely because the author has mixed up 2 English terms and then "made up" or "coined" a new Arabic word).

    The correct English word is MONOGRAPH which is a specialist work of writing on a single subject or an aspect of a subject, usually by a single author. This must be the word the author really meant to use.

    MONOGRAPHY is a drawing, a representation by lines without color - an outline drawing. (The use of MONOGRAPHY for MONOGRAPH used to be acceptable, but this meaning has long been obsolete).

    What the Arabic for both of these terms is, I don't know. But can it really be Mūnūghrāfiyat ??
     
  9. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English
    No - it's singular: مونوغرافية
     
  10. César Lasso Senior Member

    Madrid (España)
    castellano, España
    Yes! That was exactly the title I saw!

    Thank you for that:

    Muqāraba li-ȥāhira ẓāhira

    That ẓ is exactly the character I could not find. Could you please send me the capital letter so I can also copy & paste it in future occasions?

    tağliyati tajalliyyāti

    I'll have to check tomorrow if there was an alif I missed (tajliyya or tajalliyyât).

    I forgot to tell you that I'm trying to use the transliteration of the Spanish Academy of Arabists, which is quite similar to the English system of transliteration except for slight differences. J corresponds to kh, so we need something like ğ for ğeem. And we Spaniards never transliterate "madinah". Tâ' marbooTa is omitted or -t if having a dependant word:

    al-madīna

    but:

    madīnat al-Qāhira

    Thank you all for your help!
     
  11. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English

    Yes: Here is the capital: Ẓ It's interesting you capitalize the transliteration (I haven't seen that done before).
     
  12. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    Maybe it is just آلية? The ta2 marbutah is written in a funny way in magharibi script.
     
  13. Bakr Senior Member

    Arabic
    مونوغرافية المقدس بمدينة مكناس: مقاربة لظاهرة الأولياء في تجلياتها الثقافية والأدبية ودراسة آليات اشتغال الكتابة

    He is using the French term "monographie":

    Étude détaillée sur un sujet précis et limité ou sur un personnage.

    cf.http://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/monographie
     
  14. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    ẓ is in Unicode in the “Latin extended additional” subset, as are the other characters that you need for transliterated Arabic.
     
  15. akhooha Senior Member

    English - USA
    Just curious --- Where does one find this “Latin extended additional” subset?
    When I had a Mac, there was a font that included macrons on top and dots below, but nothing (that I know of) on a PC.
    Also the "Character Map" on Windows PC has all sorts of variations --- all, that is, except for dots below.
    I'd appreciate it if you'd let me know how to access this “Latin extended additional” subset. Thank you.
     
  16. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    It is available with fonts such as Times New Roman. Go to Insert > Symbols > then scroll down.
     
  17. akhooha Senior Member

    English - USA
    I'm assuming from your instructions you're referring to MS Word. Maybe I'm blind (or it's because I've got Word 2002 on this computer), but I've scrolled all the way down and have seen no letters at all with dots underneath them...(I've tried with Times New Roman, Arial, Lucida Sans Unicode, and a number of others, but with no luck...
     
  18. Bakr Senior Member

    Arabic
  19. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English
    This might help - if you have an old windows machine you need to install the universal font manually.
     
  20. akhooha Senior Member

    English - USA
    Thank you, Bakr.
    I have also found a very handy virtual keyboard that offers all the symbols necessary to write (and here's an example) al-ḥurūf alʿarabīyyah in Roman transliteration. You can use your actual keyboard (with shortcuts like z= will give you and a= gives you ā. The only characters you have to mouse-click to use are hamza ʾ and ʿain ʿ. You type out your text, then just copy and paste.
    It's at:
    http://www.lexilogos.com/clavier/arabe_latin.htm
     
  21. Bakr Senior Member

    Arabic
    It's very useful, thank you akhooha.
     
  22. César Lasso Senior Member

    Madrid (España)
    castellano, España
    Well, I see that transliterations from Arabic into Latin script capitalize less... But having a 5-year-BA in Linguistics, I cannot possibly imagine why you should capitalize "Morocco" and then transliterate "al-maghrib" - to me, it should be "al-Maghrib".

    In Spain, there is a scholar "understanding" or "agreement" to refer to the former Islamic "Portugal+Spain" as "al-Andalus" or "al-Ándalus". You can also see "Al-Andalus" or "Al Andalus" (which are definitely incorrect unless starting sentence or after fullstop).

    That is the reason why I needed available the capital Ẓ.

    Thanks a lot for your help, friends :)
     
  23. Bakr Senior Member

    Arabic
    About: The holy المقدس
    The author is talking about مفهوم المقدس
    I think of "The notion of the sacred".
     
  24. AndyRoo Senior Member

    London
    English
    Oh, You're right - I can see now they use capitals all the time in bibliographies/references etc. Never noticed before.
     
  25. César Lasso Senior Member

    Madrid (España)
    castellano, España
    Thank you, Bakr.
     

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