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All dialects: Sunday

Discussion in '中文+方言 (Chinese)' started by Ghabi, Jun 29, 2013.

  1. Ghabi

    Ghabi Moderator

    Cantonese (Hong Kong)
    Hello everyone! Just wonder how to say "Sunday" in your dialect or the dialects you know? While in Cantonese people say either 星期日 or 禮拜日, in my home the only acceptable way for that is 禮拜. Thus, when I tell my mom "我星期日先返屋企", she would reply impatiently "禮拜先返呀嘛" (obviously 星期日 doesn't make any sense to her). Am curious to know if there are other dialects that use only 禮拜. Thanks!
     
  2. SuperXW Senior Member

    這種曆法是西方傳來的,應該是有人特意翻譯傳開的,不是各地自發的,估計不會有太多的變種。
    從「星期日」「禮拜日」的字面上來看,最初的翻譯者估計出發點不同……
    讓我感興趣還有「周日/週日」的叫法,曾經在香港公共圖書館門口看到意義完全不同的「週日」,令我非常驚訝……我在以前的一個貼子中討論過,現在就不拿出來添亂了。
     
  3. Daffodil100

    Daffodil100 Senior Member

    Chinese
    Hokkien: 星期日 / 禮拜日/禮拜


    In colloquial, we omit 日。 i.e. 棉宰(明天)礼拜.

    拜一,拜二,拜三,拜四,拜五,拜六,礼拜。---地道闽南语

    星期一,二,三,四,五,六星期日--受普通话影响的闽南语

    但是闽南中没有星期这个词。


    礼拜是最通俗的也是最地道的,年长一些多用礼拜;其余两种也交替使用,受普通话影响吧。
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2013
  4. BODYholic Senior Member

    Singapore
    Chinese Cantonese
    In Singapore Teochiew, we say 礼拜 or 拜日 (i think it is short for 礼拜日). I've never heard of 星期日 in Teochiew.

    For Cantonese, I guess we are the same as in Hongkong but most people here do understand 星期日, just that "禮拜" is certainly a more common word.
     
  5. Youngfun

    Youngfun Senior Member

    Pekino, Ĉinujo
    Chinese/Italian - bilingual
    In my dialect 礼拜日 or 星期日. Probably 礼拜 more common than 星期.
    But no 天 and no 周. We don't use 天 meaning "day" and don't use 周 for "week".

    But weekend is 星期六日, for some reason more common than 礼拜六日.
    So what about the other dialects that don't have 周? How do they express weekend?


    Actually, since the week comes from the Western Christian tradition, 礼拜日/礼拜天 makes more sense (praying day) than 星期日/星期天/周日 (week day? :confused:). Probably 礼拜日 was created first, and then mirrored into 星期日……
    Or does 日 mean sun as in Sunday? :confused: I think 星期七 or 周七 make more sense. :D

    What about 日曜日、月曜日、etc.? I think those were used in China before, and now still used in Korea and Japan.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2013
  6. Ghabi

    Ghabi Moderator

    Cantonese (Hong Kong)
    Thanks for the informative replies!
    The interesting thing is that some writers during the early 20th century (like Lu Xun) actually used those, but that's obviously a re-borrowing from Japanese.:)

    I also heard that the Chinese Muslims of the Northwestern region use the Persian terms, thus Sunday is 叶克閃白 (یکشنبه).
     
  7. Lucia_zwl

    Lucia_zwl Senior Member

    口语里我们经常说“礼拜天”,比如“礼拜天有事么?逛街去呀!”
    书面语的话一般用“周日”、“星期日”和“星期天”。
     
  8. Ghabi

    Ghabi Moderator

    Cantonese (Hong Kong)
    ^謝謝!東北地區都是這樣說嗎?
     
  9. 文星辰simon Junior Member

    Montreal
    Chinese
    嗯,都这么说,反正辽宁省内都这么说,一般要把儿化礼拜天:礼拜天儿干啥去啊?
     
  10. gniaugnin New Member

    Shanghai
    Wu Chinese
    In Shanghai Wu we say 礼拜天, but when we(catholics) are talking about things within Catholic Church, we say 主日,i.e the day of Lord. The latter one is much more similar to Roman languages (dimanche, domingo, domenica, duminică, etc.) and Greek (Κυριακή).
    Moreover, in Shanghai Wu we say 礼拜一/礼拜二or礼拜两/礼拜三... generally, but when comes to catholic topics, we say 瞻礼两(Monday)/瞻礼三(Tuesday)/瞻礼四(Wednesday)/瞻礼五(Thursday)/瞻礼六(Friday)/瞻礼七(Saturday), which is almost the same as in Latin and Portuguese "segunda-feira/terça-feira/quarta-feira... 礼拜 is a word used by protestant and Anglican churches.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
  11. Daffodil100

    Daffodil100 Senior Member

    Chinese
    Interesting and informative post. :) Thank you.

    It is first time for me to learn 瞻礼
     
  12. Youngfun

    Youngfun Senior Member

    Pekino, Ĉinujo
    Chinese/Italian - bilingual
    The Beijing Christian communities also uses 主日。
     
  13. khoo1993 Junior Member

    Beijing
    Chinese
    That is brilliant, I speak 闽南语 and i am always confused with 星期日 and 礼拜
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2013
  14. Ben pan Senior Member

    chinese
    我是江西人,我们经常把星期天叫做礼拜,但很明显,这和基督教的传播有关系。不信教的人叫星期日的挺多的。
     
  15. goodatchinese Junior Member

    Mandarin,Wu-chinese
    We also say "礼拜天" for Sunday. I'm in east China.
     
  16. depaul93 New Member

    Chinese Mandarin
    周六&周日, 星期六&星期日, 礼拜六&礼拜天儿, 周末, 大礼拜
     
  17. PurplePanada Banned

    hndi
    i am not very good in Chinese but after getting little bit help i found that 星期日its mean Sunday but i think that words 禮拜日 which one your mom use its come from Japaneses...
     
  18. xiaolijie

    xiaolijie MOD

    UK
    English (UK)
    Interesting information! I speak Japanese but I've never heard of this word in Japanese. Are you sure of the reliability of your source, PurplePanada? If not, please do not post what you yourself are not quite sure of.
     
  19. depaul93 New Member

    Chinese Mandarin
    @xiaolijie, it's true that from 19th century, japanese began to influence chinese, there are many modern chinese words come from japanese. For example, "革命"-revolution, "经济"-economy, "社会"-society, "党"-party, "劳动"-labour, "知识"-knowledge, etc. But as for"礼拜X", I'm not sure whether it comes from japanese...
     
  20. xiaolijie

    xiaolijie MOD

    UK
    English (UK)
    Yes, Chinese imported a number of words from Japanese, but 禮拜日 is not one of those. From the combination of the characters, it looks likely to have origin from the West.
     
  21. Skatinginbc

    Skatinginbc Senior Member

    Canada
    Mandarin 國語
    Way back to the Tang Dynasty, Chinese had acquired the concept of seven-day week through contact with peoples from the Western Region 西域. The seven days include [FONT=&amp]日曜日[/FONT](Sunday). Those terms were used by Buddhists and borrowed into Japanese. [FONT=&amp]日曜日[/FONT](Sunday) was also called 密日. 密 was obviously the Chinese transliteration for Mithra, the Iranian Sun God. It shows the influence of Sogdians 粟特 who at that time dominated the commerce along the Silk Road.

    礼拜 is a pure Chinese term, in use at least since the Han Dynasty (e.g., 汉班固 白虎通》). It originally means "对人施拜示敬". Buddhists might be the ones who first used it for the meaning of 向神行礼致敬。For instance, 南朝 宋 刘义庆 《[FONT=&amp]世[/FONT]说新语 ·排调》:“ 何次道 往 瓦官寺 ,礼拜甚勤。” 唐 刘禹锡 《送僧仲剬东游兼寄呈灵澈上人》诗:“晴空礼拜见真像,金毛玉髻卿云间."

    Some online authors claimed A[FONT=&amp]l-Jumu‘ah [/FONT]"gathering day" (the first day of the week) of the Islamic calender could be the origin for 礼拜日 without backing it up with ancient texts. I will take it with a grain of salt for now. Concrete evidence, however, came from Christian communities. It was attested in 陳逢衡's 英吉利纪略 (1842). By the time of Christian-based [FONT=&amp]太平天国[/FONT] ([FONT=&amp]上帝天国[/FONT][FONT=&amp]、天父天兄天王太平天国[/FONT])(1851-1864), which occupied a significant part of southern China, 礼拜日 was already an established term. It was used in[FONT=&amp] 太平天曆[/FONT], which made it from a Christian/academic jargon to everyday uses.
     
  22. xiaolijie

    xiaolijie MOD

    UK
    English (UK)
    We were not discussing the origin of 礼拜 or 日. They both no doubt have ancient history in Chinese. It's the origin of 礼拜日 that the previous few posts were about. Please keep to the point and there is no need to go beyond that.
     
  23. Ghabi

    Ghabi Moderator

    Cantonese (Hong Kong)
    Hello! Thanks all for the additional responses!
    Al-jum3a الجمعة (主麻 in Chinese Muslim speech) is "Friday", and it's not the first day of the week in Islamic calender. It doesn't seem to have much to do with "Sunday".

    If I understand correctly, 礼拜日 in 天[FONT=&amp]曆 refers to our "Saturday", not[/FONT] "Sunday".
     
  24. Skatinginbc

    Skatinginbc Senior Member

    Canada
    Mandarin 國語
    [FONT=&amp]The one-day difference, if I understand correctly, is like your Sunday in Hongkong is actually my Saturday in Canada. Despite one day difference between yours and mine, the term "Sunday" still carries the same concept. [/FONT][FONT=&amp] Evidence: [/FONT]《麥華佗等一八五四年五月訪問天京文件輯錄》在...曆書中差了一天,結果禮拜日就早一天...天朝曆書,凡禮拜皆是中國人舊曆星、昴、虛、房四宿日...二十八宿入曆值日中,“虛、房、星、昴”正相當於“土、日、月、火、木、金”七曜紀日法中的“日曜日” (星期日)。http://www.liushangting.com/simple/?t2753.html. In other words, 天[FONT=&amp]曆's [/FONT]礼拜日 was meant to represent “日曜日” (星期日) despite the one day difference in actuality. [FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]The [/FONT]清 government ridiculed [/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]太平天国[/FONT] for not being able to count. International diplomats at that time even sent official letters to [/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]太平天国[/FONT] for clarification. [/FONT][FONT=&amp]As far as the etymology of 礼拜日 as the name of a day of the week is concerned, [FONT=&amp]太平天国[/FONT] certainly popularized the term.
    [/FONT]Just to add: [FONT=&amp]禮拜[/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]日[/FONT] was actually called "[/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]禮拜" without the [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]日[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp] in [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]太平[/FONT][/FONT]天[FONT=&amp]曆[/FONT]. [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT] Taiwanese 方言 permits [FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]禮拜 or [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&amp]禮拜日 but bars [/FONT][FONT=&amp][/FONT][FONT=&amp][FONT=&amp]"禮拜[/FONT][/FONT]天", which is acceptable however in 國語.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2013

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