attorney / prosecutor

Discussion in 'Legal Terminology' started by Alexmagno, Jun 7, 2014.

  1. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
    Their top target was Charles Turner, the U.S. attorney for Oregon. His prosecutors were investigating immigration fraud at the commune. A federal mediator disclosed to the Rajneeshees that criminal charges were likely and might include the guru himself. He also disclosed that Sheela probably would be charged.


    P.D.: Vi que "Dave Frohnmayer, the state attorney general, " fue traducido como "procurador general...".


    Espero ansioso sus respuestas.
     
  2. Salvatore Rina Senior Member

    Español
    US Attorney; Fiscal Federal
    prosecutor:Agente del Ministerio Público
     
  3. litiga8or

    litiga8or Senior Member

    Oregon, USA
    Rainy Oregon! USA


    The prosecutor is one kind of attorney, who works for the government, prosecuting criminal charges. Davd Frohnmeyer was the Attorney General for Oregon. His subordinates were Assistant Attorneys General, and they were the prosecutors for state criminal charges. Charles Turner was the U.S. Attorney for Oregon, and his subordinates were the Assistant U.S. Attorneys, who were the prosecutors for federal criminal charges.

    We use the term "Attorney General" and "U.S. Attorney" often to refer to any of the attorneys in the group, not just the head of the department. We use the term "prosecutor" to refer to any attorney who is handling a criminal case for the government. A prosecutor is one kind of attorney.
     
  4. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
    Gracias, pero aún me parece algo difícil, me refiero a la traducción.

    ¿Cómo se traduciría entonces "prosecutors" en el contexto de arriba y cómo Attorney? :(
     
  5. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
    What's the difference between "for state criminal charges" (Assistant Attorneys General) and "for federal criminal charges" (Assistant U.S. Attorneys)?
     
  6. Salvatore Rina Senior Member

    Español
    En relación con tu post número 4. te diría que no busques traducciones tan literales de las cosas.

    Respecto del número 5, en el primer caso es fuero común. En ell segundo, es federal
     
  7. litiga8or

    litiga8or Senior Member

    Oregon, USA
    Rainy Oregon! USA
    Alexmagno,

    It's the difference of which government is bringing the charges. In a country like the United States, we have the federal government (national) based in Washington D.C., and a set of federal laws. If someone breaks a federal criminal law, the federal prosecutors bring the charges and the case is heard in federal court. In the federal system.

    The second system is the state system. Each state has it's own separate laws, and a separate prosecutor, and separate courts.

    The third system is the tribal system. Many, or most, Indian tribes now have their own laws and their own courts and their own prosecutors.

    So first, we have to know which system we are talking about. Then we have to know which term is used in that system. The terminology varies.
     
  8. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
    Muchísimas gracias litiga8or :)

    1) En pocas palabras, ¿"lo federal" está a un nivel por encima del "estatal"? ¿Charles Turner tiene un grado "más elevado" que David Frohnmayer?


    2) Ya aprenderé esos términos. Por lo pronto, quisiera que esos términos se entiendan para todo hispanohablante.

    ¿Qué opinas de traducir "prosecutors" como "procesadores legales", "U.S. Attorney" como [simplemente] "fiscal", y "state attorney general" como "procurador general"? Así:

    Su principal objetivo fue Charles Turner, fiscal "para" Oregón. Sus "procesadores legales" (¿o asistentes legales?) estaban investigando el fraude de inmigración dentro de la comuna. Un mediador federal reveló a los rajnishes que cargos criminales eran posibles y podrían incluir al gurú mismo. También reveló que Sheela sería acusada.

    Dave Frohnmayer, el "procurador general del estado", [...]


    ¿qué opinan?
     
  9. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    1) No, lo federal no está por encima de lo estatal. Son dos óordenes de gobierno y del estado que conviven y cohabitan simultáneamente. Cada cual tiene su propia competencia, pero uno no está "encima" del otro.
    2) Es un tema de nomenclatura según cada país. Para algo genérico que "todos" entiendan, puedes referirte al prosecutor como ministerio público o fiscal.
    El US Attorney y State General Attorney son ambos "Procuradores", uno del estado, el otro de la federación. Cuando menos seria la terminología que desprendo de mi país, donde tenemos al Procurador General de la República y a los Procuradores Generales de cada Estado.
    ojalá te sirva.
    Suerte!
     
  10. litiga8or

    litiga8or Senior Member

    Oregon, USA
    Rainy Oregon! USA
    Alexmango,

    The concept of "federalism" is often hard for people from other countries to understand. We have THREE systems, here, side by side. Try to think of the United States like the European Union. Each country in the EU, like each state in the U.S., has its own government and laws. But they also have to obey certain laws of the E.U. In the beginning (1776 or 1789), the U.S. federal government was small and weak, and each State had its own power. Over the past 300 years, the power of the Federal government has grown and grown, and now we have a large Federal system. But we also still have each individual state, with its own separate powers, courts, and government. And don't forget about the Indians -- Tribes are a third system. So we have three systems, side by side, often competing.
     
  11. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
  12. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    You are right, different systems side by side, indeed.
    Forgot about the indians. In Mexico we have that too, the rules of the indigenous peoples are also recognized and respected.
    Suerte!
     
  13. olimpia91 Senior Member

    Castellano - Argentina
    David Frohnmeyer was the Attorney General for Oregon (Procurador General de Oregon). His subordinates were Assistant Attorneys General (Asistentes del Procurador General), and they were the prosecutors (fiscales a cargo) for state criminal charges. Charles Turner was the U.S. Attorney for Oregon (Procurador Federal en Oregon), and his subordinates were the Assistant U.S. Attorneys (Asistentes del Procurador Federal), who were the prosecutors (fiscales a cargo) for federal criminal charges.
     
  14. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    Ya entendí Alex. Turner es US Attorney, lo podrías nombrar como Funcionario de la Procuraduría Federal de los EU en o para el Distrito de Oregon, en tanto que Frohnmayer es el Procurador estatal.Cada Federación puede nombrar a sus funcionarios distinto. Nosotros en México entenderíamos a Turner como el Delegado de la PGR para el Distrito de X (Oregon). Dave es sin duda es Procurador General del Estado de (Oregon).
    Complicado. Suerte.
     
  15. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    Ya con Olimpia me quedó todavía más claro.
    Como explicó litiga8or, el sistema federal tiene leyes e instituciones que existen y funcionan side by side.
    Aquí existen delitos, o cargos criminales como dicen los estadounidenses, por ciertos hechos. Tales hechos son penalizados por leyes tanto federales como estatales. Cada orden jurídico, sea federal o estatal, debe ser hecho valer (enforced) por funcionarios competentes. Así, los competentes para los delitos estatales son los fiscales y procuradores del estado, y para los delitos federales los competentes son los procuradores y fiscales federales. Ninguno puede invadir la competencia del otro: por eso son side by side.
    Suerte!
     
  16. olimpia91 Senior Member

    Castellano - Argentina
    Los fiscales son casi siempre fiscales, pero su jefe suele llamarse principalmente Procurador General, pero también Fiscal General, a cargo de la Procuraduría General o Fiscalía General.
     
  17. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    Ves Alex? En terminología de funcionarios cada país escoge su nomenclatura.
     
  18. Alexmagno Junior Member

    Español - Perú
    ¡Gracias! Muchísimas gracias, ya sé cómo traducirlo. :)
     
  19. luigivanilli Senior Member

    Mexico City
    Mexican Spanish
    ¿Y cómo quedó??
     

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