autoreferenziale

Discussion in 'Italian-English' started by alberag, Sep 26, 2006.

  1. alberag New Member

    Italian
    Come posso tradurre il termine autoreferenziale?
    La frase è "questo corso è stato il pretesto per inserire una riflessione in un contesto autoreferenziale".
    Io ho pensato a qualcosa del tipo: "this training course was the pretext to open the debate in a field that is historically self-referent".

    Se qualcuno ha suggerimenti

    saluti

    alberto
     
  2. Mickele

    Mickele Senior Member

    Italian, Tuscany
    Ciao alberto. Il mio suggerimento è "This training course aimed to open a debate on a historically self-referring subject".

    Spero possa esserti d'aiuto. :)
     
  3. Outsider Senior Member

    Portuguese (Portugal)
    Io lo traduiria così:

    "This (training) course was a pretext to open a debate in a self-referential context."
     
  4. alberag New Member

    Italian
    Thank you friends!!
     
  5. alein Senior Member

    Italian
    Goodnight.

    How can I translate AUTOREFERENZIALE ?
     
  6. TimLA

    TimLA Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    English - US

    Good evening...

    Self-referring
    Self-referential
    and maybe some others

    But we need more context to be the most accurate.
    Can you give us the entire sentence?
     
  7. Salegrosso Senior Member

    Napoli (Italy)
    Verona (Italy)
    I try with ignorance... self-referred?

    Wow, almost right... I see now Tim.
     
  8. alein Senior Member

    Italian
    Thank you. The sentence is:

    operazione curatoriale non come esperienza autoreferenziale del curatore, ma come attività di messa in gioco costante, per far emergere il percorso, il processo, lo scheletro dell’operazione stessa, nella continua tensione tra articolazioni.

    curatorial work not like an ....... experience, but like an activity , to come always into play, to stand out the way, the process, the operation’s skeleton, in a continuous tension between articulations.
     
  9. TimLA

    TimLA Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    English - US
    ...operazione curatoriale
    non come esperienza autoreferenziale del curatore,
    ma come attività di messa in gioco costante,
    per far emergere il percorso,
    il processo,
    lo scheletro dell’operazione stessa,
    nella continua tensione tra articolazioni.

    Ecco il mio tentativo - è difficile perchè è molto figurato.

    ...curatorial work, not a self-referential activity of the curator, but rather that never-ending task that allows the best path to emerge, the process -the operation’s own skeleton - in constant tension between its articulations.

    Veramente, dobbiamo aspettare altri opinioni...
    Forse "path throught the exhibit" sia meglio, dipende dal testo prima e dopo.
    Anche, non mi piace tanto né "articulations" né "joints", ma data la referenza a un scheletro dobbiamo scegliere uno delle due.

    Vediamo...
     
  10. Salegrosso Senior Member

    Napoli (Italy)
    Verona (Italy)
    Complimenti!
    Only a remark:
    best path is only percorso (not migliore) in the Italian version. But, in fact, best path sounds very good.
    And a question: task means messa in gioco? In general or only in this context?
     
  11. alein Senior Member

    Italian
    Ok, thank you very much for your kindness
     
  12. TimLA

    TimLA Senior Member

    Los Angeles
    English - US
    This is one of the problems - I think that percorso refers to the path that a person would walk through the mostra. But the whole sentence talks about a process of how to link the "skeleton" together, so, to me "best path" would imply the someone is working hard to determine how to best diplay the mostra.

    I intentionally left out the "messa in gioco" because it didn't sound "academic" enough - it didn't have the right sound for this high level of text.

    I really think it would be good to have other opinions here.
    Do you see the translation as a "reasonable" copy of the original Italian?
     
  13. Salegrosso Senior Member

    Napoli (Italy)
    Verona (Italy)
    In my opinion, very reasonable, very close.
     
  14. gaiaam

    gaiaam Senior Member

    Rome
    ITALIAN
    Ciao a tutti,

    non ho trovato da nessuna parte questo termine 'autoreferenziale', potreste aiutarmi a tradurlo?

    Il testo veicola un messaggio percepito come eccessivamente autoreferenziale e presuntuoso

    Grazie
    gaia
     
  15. nexus Senior Member

    Ferrara
    italian, italy
  16. gaiaam

    gaiaam Senior Member

    Rome
    ITALIAN
    Grazie mille :)
     
  17. Mohole Senior Member

    Belgium
    Italian
    Hi all,
    I'd need to translate the following sentence:

    "L'università italiana è troppo autoreferenziale".

    I'm really struggling with that autoreferenziale.
    In Italian, a part form the literal meaning of self-referring (or self-referential, see here), it may also mean something like: self-reliable or "self-sufficient". But in this case, it has quite a negative connotation. In other words, if a person or, more often, an organisation is auto-referenziale, it means that it only follows an internal logic, that it is "closed in itself", witout minding too much to external consequences stemming from its actions, or without considering external constraints, laws, etc. In a way, it could be a synonymy for autarachy and also selfish.

    Can someone tell me if there is an equivalent, or something close in English?
    Thank you
     
  18. Einstein

    Einstein Senior Member

    Milano, Italia
    UK, English
    Mi viene in mente "internally consistent", cioè coerente con se stesso ma slegato dal mondo esterno, ma non è giusto per descrivere un'università. Però forse stimola un po' di brainstorming...
     
  19. london calling Senior Member

    SALERNO, ITALY
    UK ENGLISH
    Yes, the meaning here is that Italian universities do their own thing without bothering about the consequences (if not to themselves). Not easy!

    The meaning is similar to "una repubblica a parte", don't you think? What about "Italian universities are a world on their own" (?).
     
  20. Einstein

    Einstein Senior Member

    Milano, Italia
    UK, English
    Not bad!:)
     
  21. Mohole Senior Member

    Belgium
    Italian
    Thank you for your suggestions Einstein and london calling
     

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