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BCS: Reflexive si/sebi

Discussion in 'Other Slavic Languages' started by Bresca, Nov 19, 2012.

  1. Bresca Senior Member

    Dear foreros, I have a doubt with the reflexive verbs with the pronoun "se". If I say "I buy an ice cream to me" (maybe this sentence in English is a bit strange, but for instance in Italian it would be very natural "mi compro un gelato"), what's the colloquial (and correct) way of saying it in BCS: "kupim sebi sladoled" or "kupim si sladoled"? I think that I've heard the second one, but I'm not sure.

    Thanks.
     
  2. Duya Senior Member

    Not in WR world
    Whatever
    Non-clitic sebi is correct in all BCS standards.

    Clitic form si is used in Croatian, particularly in colloquial, much less so in Bosnian, and it is not used in Serbian at all.

    By the way, *Kupim sebi sladoled. is not a grammatical full sentence in either BCS standard: present tense of perfective verb kupiti cannot be used in a main clause (with certain exceptions, e.g. expressing repetitiveness). You have to use imperfective form kupujem or another tense (kupiću, kupio sam).
     
  3. Bresca Senior Member

    Hvala. Onda, kupiću sebi sladoled!
     
  4. nrocco1 Junior Member

    Bresca, I would add that sebi is most often used emphatically, where si is the more common reflexive form. Croatians would certainly say: "Kupit cu si sladoled" (or kupujem or whichever form of the verb). Sebi would be used where the speaker wishes to emphazise that the ice cream is for him/her and not for others: "Kupit cu sebi sladoled, a tebi novine".
     
  5. Bresca Senior Member

    Thanks, Nrocco:

    so, si/sebi mantains in Croatian the same pattern of non emphatic/emphatic meanings, like mi/meni, me /mene.. itd. of other personal pronouns.

    Hvala.
     
  6. nrocco1 Junior Member

    "so, si/sebi mantains in Croatian the same pattern of non emphatic/emphatic meanings, like mi/meni, me /mene.. itd. of other personal pronouns. Hvala."

    Exactly!
     
  7. Bresca Senior Member

    If I use the 2nd singular person of biti (si), a sentence like: "ti si si kupio novi auto" would be OK or Croatians would prefer saying "sebi ti si kupio novi auto"? (I say this because of the doble "si", that maybe disturbs...)
     
  8. nrocco1 Junior Member

    Sebi would only be used for emphasis. To avoid a double-si, which - as you correctly assume - disturbs the ear, Croatians would usually just leave it out: "Kupio si novi auto".
     
  9. Bresca Senior Member

    Bože moj! I didnt' thought in this obvious option!! Thanks.
     
  10. Duya Senior Member

    Not in WR world
    Whatever
    That is basically how Serbian handles absence of the clitic form: since possession is most often understood from context, it is simply dropped:

    Kupio sam * novi auto.
    Nađi * nešto čime ćeš se zabaviti.
    Našao sam * devojku.


    In places marked with asterisks, Croats would often insert a si (particularly in colloquial, I don't find it much high-register), while Serbs would omit it. When an emphasis is needed, then the emphatic sebi is used anyway.
     

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