BCS: zbog, radi, poradi, zaradi

Discussion in 'Other Slavic Languages' started by Miliu, Dec 19, 2012.

  1. Miliu Junior Member

    Madeira
    Portuguese
    Dear foreros:

    to indicate the cause, are this four prepositions equivalent?

    Thanks.
     
  2. Gnoj Senior Member

    Macedonia
    Macedonian
    I'd like to know that, too. I didn't know there's "poradi" and "zaradi" in BCS. We have them in Macedonian, but I've never seen them used in BCS.
     
  3. Duya Senior Member

    Not in WR world
    Whatever
    Radi and zbog, although sometimes confused even by native speakers, mean quite different things:

    • Zbog means 'because of <cause>', i.e. takes the cause of the action as the argument
    • Radi means 'for the purpose of <end>', i.e. takes the purpose of the action of the argument.

    Zarad (without 'i') is not often used. It is an emphatic version of 'radi'.

    I've seldom heard poradi, but Google reveals some Croatian hits. HJP says it can mean both 'radi' and 'zbog'.
     
  4. Gnoj Senior Member

    Macedonia
    Macedonian
    Interesting, the same analogy zbog/radi is valid for zaradi/poradi in Macedonian.
     
  5. Miliu Junior Member

    Madeira
    Portuguese
    • Zarad (without 'i') is not often used. It is an emphatic version of 'radi'.f the action of the argument.

    I've fished this adverb from the "Hrvatskosrpsko-talijanski rječnik - Deanović-Jernej (ZG 1963)" and all of them (zarad, zaradi,poradi, radi and zbog are translated in Italian as "a causa di"="because of"): that's why I asked the differences.

    So if it's raining, zbog kiše mokar sam, but if I see black clouds nosim kišobran radi ne budem mokar: is it so?

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2012
  6. TriglavNationalPark

    TriglavNationalPark Senior Member

    Chicago, IL, U.S.A.
    Slovenian (a.k.a. Slovene)
    "Zaradi" also exists in Slovenian.
     
  7. jadeite_85 Senior Member

    Italy
    italian, slovene
    In Ukrainian too, while in Russian exists "radi".
     
  8. Anicetus Senior Member

    Croatian
    The first sentence is okay, but zbog kiše sam mokar would be a more natural word order. However, the second one won't work at all. Radi and zbog are prepositions, not conjunctions, which means they can only be attached to a nominal word (a noun or an adjective, pronoun or number functioning as a noun) -- just like u, na, o, prema, od etc. For example: trčim radi zdravlja ("I run for health") or putujem radi zabave ("I travel for fun"). They can't be used alone to introduce a clause. If you really wanted to use radi to start a clause, I guess it would be grammatically correct to put the appropriate form of the "dummy pronoun" to with radi and then begin the clause with the final (that is, indicating purpose -- in this case) conjunction da: nosim kišobran radi toga da ne budem mokar, but that sounds rather unusual. The "radi toga" part is completely redundant and the most natural way here would be simply to use a final clause with da: nosim kišobran da ne budem mokar. Or maybe, nosim kišobran da ne pokisnem (the verb pokisnuti means "to get wet by rain"), but that's beside the point. :)

    Anyway, on the other hand, using zbog toga što to start a causal clause isn't that unusual at all (zbog with the dummy "toga" and then the clause beginning with the conjunction što). The shorter and more economical jer is definitely more common, but zbog toga što and zato što are also used to avoid repetition.
     
    Last edited: Dec 19, 2012
  9. !netko! Junior Member

    Croatian, Croatia
    The one I hear most often is zato jer :D I went through a brief phase when I tried to stop using it when speaking, but I soon just gave up. Too much effort :D
     
  10. Miliu Junior Member

    Madeira
    Portuguese
    I've seldom heard poradi, but Google reveals some Croatian hits. HJP says it can mean both 'radi' and 'zbog'.[/QUOTE]

    From internet: "..., ne poradi straha, nego po savjesti". And we see a third preposition that expresses the cause: po+accusative!
     
  11. Duya Senior Member

    Not in WR world
    Whatever
    Well, it's not the cause. In po savjesti, po simply means 'according to, by', as in po mom mišljenju 'by (in) my opinion'.
     

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