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Can be, should be

Discussion in '日本語 (Japanese)' started by ihitokage, Jan 30, 2013.

  1. ihitokage

    ihitokage Senior Member

    Czech
    Hello. I learned how to say should with "beki" and can with "eru" verb ending (form). My question is how can I use it with desu.
    For example: This paper can be white/should be white.
    Is there form like dareru or desu beki or sth like that?
    Thanks and have a nice day ^_^
     
  2. blutorange2 Junior Member

    Saxony
    German
  3. ihitokage

    ihitokage Senior Member

    Czech
    Thanks. So I can say:
    This paper should be white. - この紙は白いべきです。
    This paper can be white. - この紙は白いできる。 or is there another way? (dekiru is a bit different from -eru form I think)
     
  4. blutorange2 Junior Member

    Saxony
    German
    Where did you learn this? Just adding beki to some word doesn't work.

    Some better sources on how to use べき:
    http://dev.jgram.org/pages/viewOne.php?tagE=beki
    http://www.guidetojapanese.org/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=51483
    http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/should

    Whether you should use beki depends upon exactly what "paper should be white" is supposed to mean in which situation. (eg "Please use white paper" or "By law, you are required to use white paper" etc) To quote, "[beki] is considered strong because the thing that is expected to happen usually carries a sense of obligation (generally social) and if what should happen doesn't there is an implied sense of dire consequences for the person."

    "This paper can be white."
    As for この紙は白いできる, you can't just add dekiru to an adjective. At any rate, it using dekiru would mean something like "paper is able to be white"/"it is possible for this paper to be white". You could use, for example, 〜でもいい(です)to say "〜 is also alright"/"you may (use)〜".
     
  5. ihitokage

    ihitokage Senior Member

    Czech
    Yeah I know I cannot use beki without verb. I just didn't know how to use it with desu.
    Now I see I should use すべき or するべき instead?

    About "can". I know it is bad example but I was just curious if there is form of "can be". Like the other verbs. I know desu is a bit different.
     
  6. blutorange2 Junior Member

    Saxony
    German
    Literally, "can be" could be translated as 有り得る, eg "事故の発生はありうることだ", or 居ることができる. The best way to say something depends on what it is you want to say exactly.
    Take a look at how many different expressions there are one could translate with "can be": http://ejje.weblio.jp/sentence/content/"can+be"

    Grammatically/historically, すべき is the correct form, but するべき can be found all over the place today as well.
     
  7. ihitokage

    ihitokage Senior Member

    Czech
    Thank you very much for quick help and patience with me. You helped me a lot. ^_^
     

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