1. peterdexter New Member

    He leido que la traduccion de la palabra inglés "cognate" es cognado. Sin embargo alguien acá en Colombia me dijo que no utilicen esa palabra sino otra que ya no me acuerdo. ¿Será que alguien aquí sabe la palabra de la que estoy hablando? Gracias.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2014
  2. Búkarus

    Búkarus Senior Member

    Colombia, castellano
    Hi,
    From this part of Colombia (you are in th SW and I am in the NE) you won't hear that word either. But I found some synonyms for "cognado" in the "Diccionario de sinónimos y antónimos © 2005 Espasa-Calpe S.A., Madrid" used by the forums:

    cognado
    semejante, parecido, asimilado, afín

    And I have others: similar, símil, análogo, par.

    But somehow, it seems to me that's not what you're looking for.

    Can you give us a definition or some synonyms of "cognate"?

    Bye ;)
     
  3. Diddy Senior Member

    C.A. Spanish
    ¡¡¡Bienvenido al foro!!!

    Una definición de cognado sería:

    cognado: emparentado morfológicamente.

    saludos,
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  4. Búkarus

    Búkarus Senior Member

    Colombia, castellano
    Hi again,
    These are some other possibilites, according to some congnado's defininitions: emparentado (adj.), pariente (noun), consanguíneo (adj./noun).

    Los delfines están emparentados con las ballenas.
    Dolphins are cognate to whales. (<—Is that correctly written?)

    But it will be usefull if you give us a context where to put the word.

    Oh, I'm sorry for having been so unpolite: WELCOME!

    And remember: reading the forum's rules and tips will be very useful for you to get the answers that you really need.

    Bye ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  5. andylopez

    andylopez Senior Member

    Madrid, Spain
    Spanish - Castellano
    :cross:cosanguíneo no existe en el diccionario de la lengua castellana

    :tick: consanguíneo en cambio, sí.
     
  6. pumpkin

    pumpkin Senior Member

    Washington, DC
    English, US

    Hello,
    You could use "cognate" in that sense, in the sense of two things not exactly the same but very similar because they have the same origin, but I think what Peter was looking for was a synonym for "cognado" in the specific sense of cognate words. In Spanish class they call words like "air" and "aire" cognados.
     
  7. BocaJuniors

    BocaJuniors Senior Member

    NASA Space Center, Mississippi, USA.
    Spanish & English (parejos y por añales)
    Dolphins are related to whales ... ¿qué no?
     
  8. abogado máximo New Member

    USA
    Cognado is one of my favorite words, but I have had Spanish language professors in three South American countries (Argentina, Perú and Colombia) tell me it doesn't exist, yet it is used all the time in language classes here in the U.S. "Dolphins are cognate to whales" may be technically correct because both species decend from a common ancestral animal, however you'd never hear it said that way in English. We'd say "Dolphins are related to whales," so the meaning in context would be "related to." All the definitions given previously by other responders appear correct, but the only context in which I have ever heard either "cognate" or "cognado" used is in language. Webster's English Dictionary defines "cognate" as "related, especially: related by decent from the same ancestral language." The Diccionario de la Academia Real de España defines cognado (as Dilly said previously) as "emparentado morfológicamente," and it also discloses the common ancestor in Latin, which is "cognatus". Cognado and cognate are themselves cognates, of course. English speaking Spanish teachers everywhere instinctively and subconsciously speak to students in cognados, so as to allow the student with limited vocabulary to intuit meaning in Spanish from the English cognate. That's one reason why students find it easier to understand Spanish spoken by Spanish teachers than Spanish spoken by others; the teachers consciously or unconsciously shift to speaking in cognates. It is said that there are more cognados between English and Spanish than between English and any other romance language, which is why English speakers perceive Spanish as an "easy" language to learn.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2011
  9. dinis.dinis Senior Member

    USA/English
    The Diccionario de la Lengua Española (RAE) defines 'Doblete' as:

    In English we may the say that the two terms mentioned in the above excerpt are '
    Cognates'

    Best Wishes,
    Dinis
     
  10. macame

    macame Senior Member

    Half a mile to heaven
    Spanish & Galician
    False friends = false cognates
     
  11. abogado máximo New Member

    USA
    I'm not a linguist, just interested in linguistics, however I believe the word "doblete" is a "cognate" of the English word "doublet," however doublets occur within the same language and cognates occur between two languages. What is exciting is to see the term defined in the RAE, because that suggests that doublets exist in Spanish and not only English. There is a very interesting article on Wikipedia at the following link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin_influence_in_English that includes an extensive list of doublets, but for those not interested in reading the article, it's like cow/beef, moon/lunar, sun/solar, heart/cardiac, boat/naval, dog/canine (and the list goes on). This results within English from the historical roots of the language, part having Germanic roots in Anglo-Saxon (and the Vikings), and Latinate influences that came into the language when the Romans conquered Britania and brought Latin as the language of the ruling class. Latin returned indirectly to English in 1066 C.E. when the Normans invaded England, bringing Norman French as the language of the ruling class. French has its roots in Latin. Latin also penetrated English through the Church which translated and copied manuscripts in Latin in the Dark Ages. In "doublets" as I know the term, "dog" (a noun) is of Germanic origin and "canine" is Latinate. "Boat" is Germanic and "naval" (nave in Spanish) is Latin origin. The English language eventually sorted out this dual language issue along lines where nouns ("boat") are of Germanic origin, and Latinate words ("naval") are adjectives. Looking at the examples above, you can see the pattern. It is very well-described in the article at the link above. But my point is that although "doblete" itself is a cognate of "doublet," dobletes no son cognados. Los términos no son sinónimos. In the latter sentence, "término" is a cognate of "term" and "sinónimo" is a cognate of "synonymous". But "doublets" appear in the same language and cognates are comparable terms with the same sound and meaning between two languages. Makes you wonder which two languages cause dobletes to occur in Spanish (Arabic?), and it makes you wonder what some of those words might be? Perhaps "Inshalla" and "ójala"? But those would be cognates . . .
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2011
  12. dinis.dinis Senior Member

    USA/English
    I just wanted to share these few points taken from the Wikipedia entries on Cognates and Doublets in order to shed more light on this topic:

    It is true that(etymological) doublets are found only within the same language. They do, however, constitute a subset of the term cognates. That is to say all (etymological) doublets are cognates since they share the same root (etymon):



    Again, cognates are neither limmited to terms deriving from different languages nor do they, necessarily, exhibit "the same meaning".


    'Doublets' is a more loosely defined term than 'cognates' (it may, also, refer to a certain mens' garment, a gem assembled from two stones, or two optical lenses stacked one upon the other inter alia) but, within the study of etymology, 'doublets' are both cognate (since they derive from the same source) and generally semantically divergent (i.e. non-synonymous):

    With Best Regards,
    Dinis
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2011
  13. abogado máximo New Member

    USA
    I agree with dinis.dinis’ correction that cognates need not necessarily have the same meaning. It was risky to add “and meaning” in that line, because it is usually but not necessarily so. If a genetic analysis of cognates were possible, the same linguistic genes would run through both cognate words, revealing that each evolved from a common parent. So if the Latin root word “cognatus” means “blood relative” (which it does) then there is no blood relation between “dog” and “canine” (doublets) because they do not share a common ancestor, one word deriving from a Germanic ancestor and the other from a Latin one. By definition then, “doublets” (dobletes) cannot be “a subset of the term cognates” because doblados share no common blood ancestor. (Is there a geneticist in the house?) As “macame” points out, there are many examples of “amigos falsos” (= false cognates) like the classical example of “embarrassed” and “embarazada.”. The Shorter Oxford English Disctionary defines “embarrass” as “to encumber, hamper, impede . . . perplex, render difficult or complicate,” etymologically entering English via French. “Embarazada” means “pregnant.” As a more recent example of linguistic drift, neither embarrass nor embarazada bear any relation to how we use “embarrass” in the U.S. today. Etymologically, these words evolved different meanings, although one could argue that a pregnant woman is certainly “encumbered.” However, to return to “peterdexter’s” original question, “cognate” and “cognado” are themselves cognados, and I cannot think of another Spanish word that could be used to describe the concept any better, unless you wanted to try “equivalent,” which is “equivalente” in Spanish, and yet another set of cognates . . .
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2011
  14. abogado máximo New Member

    USA
    With all this discussion of cognados being “blood relatives” deriving from Latin roots, we should be mindful that “Latin roots” are not necessarily required. Cognates are springing up all the time in present day, such as “satellite” (satélite), “radio” (radio), “computer” (computadora), “helicopter” (helicóptero), “television” (televisión) and so forth, things the Romans had no words for. The common “blood” in these is modern times, and there is no word evolution or etymology to speak of. In a marketplace of global communication, words like “ordenador” (computer) compete with others like “computadora” for general acceptance. Whether you can truly call these “cognados” seems open to debate, depending on how technical you want to be. My favorite verb “cognado” recently has been “googlear” (to Google). Si tenga problemas con este verbo, debería googléalo . . .
     
  15. dinis.dinis Senior Member

    USA/English
    In regards to Albogado Maximo's statement that

    one would do well to consult the first sentence of the Wikipedia entry: Doublet (linguistics) :

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublet_(linguistics)

    Here we see that etymological doublets, by definition, are cognate. They share the same etymon and, as such, may, indeed, be so-termed "blood relatives' --- (if this is interpreted to suggest that they share common morphological origins).

    Abogado Maximo seems, also, to have blurred the distinction between false cognates and false fiends when he presents the equation:
    The distinction between false friends and cognates is based on the sense of the term cognate which is, after all, the very purpose of this thread:

    ,
    while false cognates
    Notice how the concept of false friends is something entirely different from false cognates. It is not directly concerned with the origins of a word (diachronical questions) but rather with its morphological or phonological similarity to any
    non-synonymous term within another language:

    A pair of false friends can thus be comprised of mere homonyms like English, can (Penisul. una lata/ Mex. un bote ), and Spanish, can (dog). These false friends lack any cognate relationship whatsoever.

    On the other hand, some false friends (false look-alikes or sound-alikes) may, also, possess true cognate origins since they may share an ancestor.

    Some of my favorite true-cognate-but-false-friend pairs between Spanish and English are 'eager' and 'agrio", 'fray' and 'fregar' and lastly 'nice' and 'necio' which are, at once, very cognate and very semantically diverged!

    Best Wishes to You,
    Dinis
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2011

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