1. The WordReference Forums have moved to new forum software. (Details)

commute, commuting, commuter

Discussion in 'العربية (Arabic)' started by إسكندراني, Feb 5, 2013.

  1. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    السلام عليكم
    هل تعرفون لهذه الكلمة مقابلا عربيا؟ ومعناها المقصود عندي هو المعنى المعتاد وهو
    السفر من وإلى مكان العمل أو الدراسة
    وتشير إلى مفهوم ارتياد المكان يوميا لغرض العمل أو الدراسة (فقط، وليس للترفيه مثلا ولا للتسوق) ومنها اشتقت مصطلحات عديدة
    commuters
    commuter town
    commute time
    إلخ
    في انتظار اقتراحاتكم
     
  2. salsabeel Senior Member

    arabic
    ممكن "انتقال"
     
  3. Abu Talha

    Abu Talha Senior Member

    Urdu

    وعليكم السلام
    لا أدري مصطلحا يفيد المعنى المقصود ولكن لو خضنا في استحداث تعبير جديد فما رأيك في السير اليومي أو الأسبوعي أو ، عمومًا ، الاطرادي؟
    مثلا:
    سيري اليومي خمسة أميال.

     
  4. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    شكرا لإجابتكما الاستفسار
    لكن كيف إذا نقول
    commuter town
    وهو المصطلح المستعصي علي ترجمته

    للعلم فالسائرين يقصدون أشغالهم اليومية
    تلك الجملة مفهومة بالنسبة لعامة الناس على ما أظن
     
  5. Crimson-Sky

    Crimson-Sky Senior Member

    بلاد بابل - Babylonia
    Arabic-العربية
    السلام عليكم
    Wikipedia says the equivalent of "commuter town" in Arabic is بلدة تابعة.


    [h=1][/h][h=1][/h]
     
  6. Crimson-Sky

    Crimson-Sky Senior Member

    بلاد بابل - Babylonia
    Arabic-العربية
    If I'm not abusing "commuter town" could also mean "ضاحية" ; "ضاحية" has some of the characteristics of "commuter town".
     
  7. cherine

    cherine Moderator

    Alexandria, Egypt
    Arabic (Egypt).
    I thought about ضاحية too, but I'm not sure.

    I don't think we have an Arabic term for commuting, and all its derived words/forms, unfortunately. We'd need to find an equivalent that could be as close as possible.
    For example, for commuting time, maybe زمن المواصلات or الوقت الذي تستغرقه المسافة (though it's a bit too long).
     
  8. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    Yes, I think this is a term that MSA lacks.
    I am willing to go as high as two words in an إضافة :D but no higher
    The best I have right now is ارتياد الأشغال. Like 'travel' or 'journey', سفر or ترحال are a bit different.
    سير may be the best we can come up with for now... But we must be missing something.
     
  9. cherine

    cherine Moderator

    Alexandria, Egypt
    Arabic (Egypt).
    To me, ارتياد الأشغال means going to work. It doesn't mention anything about commuting.
    سير is about walking, so I wouldn't use it either.

    MSA and dialects lack this because we simply don't have the same urban structures as in Europe and USA. This is why I suggested looking for something that can come as close as possible. Here in Alexandria, there are workers who come from as far as other cities. Every day. If this is not commuting, I don't know what it is. But we still don't have a special word for it. They/we don't even say باسافر الشغل or باسافر البيت بعد الشغل . They just come and go like everyone else باروح الشغل الصبح واروَّح آخر النهار.
     
  10. Abu Talha

    Abu Talha Senior Member

    Urdu
    Would something like الغُدُوّ والرواح work or is it too out there?

    commute time/distance مسيرة الغدو والرواح
    commuters السائرون غدوا ورواحًا

    مسيرتي ذات الغدو والرواح ساعتان يوميا
     
  11. Crimson-Sky

    Crimson-Sky Senior Member

    بلاد بابل - Babylonia
    Arabic-العربية
    Maybe we should go for "ضاحية" (about "commuter town") and here's a reason : The equivalent of the word "commuter" in French is "banlieusard" (banlieusarde for feminine), "banlieusard" comes from the word "banlieue" which means "ضاحية" in Arabic.(in a direct way).
     
  12. cherine

    cherine Moderator

    Alexandria, Egypt
    Arabic (Egypt).
    Yes, I agree with this.
    And in Egypt, we also have المدن الجديدة for the new towns built at the borders of older ones. Specially in Cairo and Alexandria.
    It is a bit out there, because الغدو والرواح is simply coming and going, but in fuS7a. Even if there's an extra connotation to it, it's lost in MSA.
     
  13. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    It's interesting that French lacks this word too (it seems they improvised a solution which is associated with the place rather than the act).
    The issue for me is one of clearly defining terms which are considered quite distinct by geographers and urban planners. Egyptian cities, like all other modern cities, have commuters. And commuter towns. And it's normal to have commuters come from over an hour away from a different city.
    But how do we Arabise these terms separately?
    ضاحية = suburb
    غير موجود = suburban (لا توجد نسبة لكلمة ضاحية في نطاق الاستخدام الحالي)
    حضر = urban area
    حضري = urban
    مدينة جديدة = new town
    مدينة تابعة is actually my own improvisation (I edit wikipedia) but it seems to be a more suitable translation for 'satellite town' - which may actually have almost no commuters; some satellite towns are quite independent.

    A commuter town is a nearby town (not necessarily new) which has become almost totally dependent on the major urban centre nearby for work. It is not a suburb because it lies outside the main urban area. A commuter town for Cairo might be Banha.
    'an urban community that is primarily residential, from which most of the workforce commutes out to create their livelihood.'

    A commuter is someone who travels within their city or to another city to and from work or education daily.

    Commuting is the act of going to or from work. Some people commute on foot, in New York some even commute by small aeroplane. Most commute by car, cycle or public transport. The minimum amount of time for what we can call a commute might be fifteen minutes.

    I am not too concerned if we don't find an equivalent for this 'commuter town', because we can tactfully avoid it. My concern is that we have no word for commuting at all. It's important for planners to discuss commute times, commuter routes, commuting trends, etc.
    Maybe we can see how the French get round this issue?
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
  14. cherine

    cherine Moderator

    Alexandria, Egypt
    Arabic (Egypt).
    We do have زمن الانتقال/المواصلات and طُرُق الانتقال (or simply الطرق) and وسائل المواصلات السائدة . Why can't we use these? :confused:
    And what is the French get round for this?
     
  15. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    طرق is not sufficient; they handle different types of traffic ضغط مروري including
    * Transport of Goods نقل البضائع
    * Intercity Travel السفر بين المدن
    * Tourists
    * and Commuters السير إلى الأشغال؟

    About French, I meant that it apparently has no verb 'to commute' ...
     
  16. Vivemafille Senior Member

    English
    I have the Wordreference translation for the verb "to commute" (يسافر). Any suggestions for the noun "a commute"?
    Example:
    I have a very long commute, 75 minutes.
    My commute is very long.

    Google Translate gives this:
    لدي اجتياز مسافة طويلة.
    تخفيف بلدي طويل.
     
  17. PlanC Senior Member

    la navette > Faire la navette *
    Faire le va-et-vient
    le même trajet quotidien...
    ....
    I don't now if we could cast the meaning (referred by the second link*) to the arabic, so it will also go along تلك الأداة (ان وجدت طبعا) و المستعملة في النسيج التقليدي (sorry I didn't found the arabic appelation yet).
    For the moment and to answer your main question maybe you could use: التردد (عن مكان ما) , ذهابا وإيابا, التكرار (السفر / الطريق المتكرر), ...الخ
    Update
    للاشارة فقط :
    إن عملية الـ: Commuting يكمن تأويلها على أنها : ارتحال يومي (بين مكان الإقامة و مقر العمل) و هو مفهوم مختلف تماما عن التجوال
    Commuter:متنقل يومي (من و الى عمله)’ا
    to Commute: يتنقل يوميا
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2015
  18. Vivemafille Senior Member

    English
    Thanks for helping me out! (And I learned a new French expression, too. I already knew "faire la navette.")
     

Share This Page