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En associant à (EN + participe présent)

Discussion in 'עברית (Hebrew)' started by Leonardoo, May 30, 2013.

  1. Leonardoo Junior Member

    Modiin
    French - France
    Hello/bonjour/שלום

    Je cherche à traduire la tournure suivante en hébreu (style littéraire) dont voici le contexte:

    "Il essaie de concilier les deux explications en associant [ou en leur faisant associer] le mot [nu] au corps de la personne et non au livre(, et en affaiblissant sa portée)."

    Here is an approximate English translation:

    "he tries to reconcile the two explanations by (means of) associating [or having them associate] the word [naked] to the body of the person and not to the book (and by weakening its significance)."

    J'ai traduit par

    הוא מנסה לישב את שני הפירושים ביחסיותם המילה "ערום" לגופו,כו' ולא לספר...
     
  2. arielipi Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    What - is - the - question?
     
  3. Leonardoo Junior Member

    Modiin
    French - France
    Is my translation in Hebrew correct (does it make sense at all) ? If not please correct it.
     
  4. Tararam Senior Member

    Hebrew
    "הוא מנסה ליישב את שני הפירושים באמצעות ייחוס המילה 'עירום' לגופו של האדם ולא לספר"
     
  5. Leonardoo Junior Member

    Modiin
    French - France

    תודה
     
  6. hadronic Senior Member

    New York
    French - France
    More generally, how do you render "by + Ving" in everyday speech ?
    "You can tell if he's lying just by looking at his face"
    The only ways I can think of sound either too archaic (gerund) or too formal (like the original example of this thread).

    Thank you !
     
  7. origumi Senior Member

    Hebrew
    See Tararam's comment. You can replace באמצעות by על ידי, you can de-construct the double construct state as באמצעות ייחוסה של המילה, these are matters of personal taste.
     
  8. arielipi Senior Member

    Israel
    Hebrew
    באמצעות לא יעבוד על הדוגמא האחרונה, על ידי בעיני יותר טוב.
     
  9. hadronic Senior Member

    New York
    French - France
    על ידי בעיני al yedey be-eynay ? Isn't it weird to put ב after על ידי ?
    My question was more, what's the generic go-to fashion to express "(just) by + V-ing" ?
    In my last example, you transformed "look" into "eye", so it's very ad-hoc and not generalizable.
    How would you say "by cooking", "by going", "by doing", "by calling",... ?
     
  10. ystab Senior Member

    Hebrew
    arielipi meant "in my opinion" when he used בעיניי. I think you misunderstood him.

    Anyway, I see two options: the action and the infinitive.
    אתה יכול לראות אם הוא משקר רק בהסתכלות על הפנים שלו. Casual.
    אתה יכול לראות אם הוא משקר רק בהסתכל על פניו. Formal and maybe archaic.
    In this particular case, מ will be more used than ב - i.e. מהסתכלות

    Another popular, though more colloquial, form is: אתה יכול לראות אם הוא משקר רק מלהסתכל על הפנים שלו.
     
  11. amikama

    amikama sordomodo

    ישראל
    עברית
    This doesn't sound quite natural to me, even for formal/archaic Hebrew.

    If I wanted to express it in formal (or archaic) Hebrew, I would probably say something like:
    .אינך יכול לראות אם הוא משקר אלא בהסתכלך על פניו
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2013
  12. hadronic Senior Member

    New York
    French - France
    That bears a different meaning : "the only way you can tell if he's lying is by looking at his face".
    This is not what my original sentence means.
     
  13. amikama

    amikama sordomodo

    ישראל
    עברית
    Yes, you're right... I didn't read closely your original sentence.
     

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