1. The WordReference Forums have moved to new forum software. (Details)

endorsement or indorsement

Discussion in 'English Only' started by gflaminiano, Nov 30, 2004.

  1. gflaminiano New Member

    Philippines and Tagalog
    << Topic: endorsement or indorsement >>

    hi!

    What is the difference between these two words? Are there any standard rules to follow?

    tnx.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2013
  2. Tomas Robinson

    Tomas Robinson Senior Member

    Puerto Rico
    USA, English & Spanish
    Hi, welcome to the forum!

    I've never seen "indorsement" used here (maybe it's more British? :confused: ), my unabridged English dictionary defines it as another form of "endorsement". In U.S. English anyway, "endorsement" is always used. it's to promote something, as in "The Chicago Tribune newspaper published an endorsement for George Bush in yesterday's edition."

    Hope this helps.... :)
    Tom
     
  3. Rob625

    Rob625 Senior Member

    Murlo (SI)
    English - England
    The same applies in British English. I would say indorsement is wrong, although my dictionary does list it as a variant.

    As well as the positive meaning, there is the endorsement you can get on your driving licence for speeding or other offences.
     
  4. Meysha

    Meysha Junior Member

    Brisbane, Australia
    Australia, English
    I've never heard of indorsement either.
     
  5. gflaminiano New Member

    Philippines and Tagalog
    thanks a lot guys!

    I am also not familiar with the word indorsement but someone did submit to me his work using that word. just checking out...

    you had been very helpful. till next time..
     
  6. keatsurn Senior Member

    Milan - Italy
    Italian
    Hi,

    I have a quick question. I've even checked on wikipedia but I'm not sure: can you use the word "endorsement" as a synonym/substitute for "contract", obviously if you're talking about a contract as a testimonial?

    Eg, "their endorsement stated that..."

    Thanks!
     
  7. panjandrum

    panjandrum PongoMod

    Belfast, Ireland
    English-Ireland (top end)
    I can't imagine endorsement as a synonym for contract.
    In some context, a contract may be considered to be an endorsement of something, but even then they are not synonyms.
     
  8. Loob

    Loob Senior Member

    English UK
    No, I don't think so.

    "Testimonial" and "endorsement" have similar but not identical meanings; "contract" means something completely different.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2009
  9. keatsurn Senior Member

    Milan - Italy
    Italian
    Thanks! I think this is an incorrect Italian usage then, sometimes we use the word to describe an agreement between a testimonial and a company, this is why I asked!

    Can you explain this?
     
  10. Loob

    Loob Senior Member

    English UK
    Can you, in turn, explain "an agreement between a testimonial and a company"?

    I don't understand "testimonial" in your sentence:(
     
  11. panjandrum

    panjandrum PongoMod

    Belfast, Ireland
    English-Ireland (top end)
    Yes.
    An endorsement is a comment on something.
    In the context talked about earlier in the thread, the endorsement is positive - I am adding a comment that is entirely positive.

    In the context of the driving licence, the endorsement is negative - they are adding a comment that is critical of the licence-holder's competence as a driver.

    A driving licence might also have an endorsement to indicate the licence-holder's additional competence to drive a wider range of vehicles.
     
  12. keatsurn Senior Member

    Milan - Italy
    Italian
    sure Loob :D language interference again :)

    Basically we call endorsement a contract or an agreement between a celebrity and a company according to which this celebrity will promote a product in an advertising campaign. We call a celebrity who signs such a contract a "testimonial"

    This is why I was checking the original meaning of endorsement :)
     
  13. panjandrum

    panjandrum PongoMod

    Belfast, Ireland
    English-Ireland (top end)
    This use of "endorsement" and "testimonial" is completely alien to me.

    A contract is not, formally, an endorsement.

    A person who signs a contract, of whatever kind, would not be referred to as a testimonial.
     
  14. Loob

    Loob Senior Member

    English UK
    Well, we can talk about Celebrity X endorsing product Y, or giving his endorsement to product Y.

    And we can talk about Person P providing a testimonial for Person Z - a document in which he describes the virtues of Person Z, and (by implication) endorses Person Z's application for a job. But a person would never be described as a testimonial.

    A contract is an agreement between two parties, under which party A agrees to provide something to party B in return for some consideration C.
     
  15. Lazulilasher Junior Member

    English, United States
    Hi,

    I'm not sure if it be kosher for me to reply to this...but there *IS* a specific usage for the word, and I wanted to alert future searchers (as I am a frequent word-reference user, and often rely on these posts.)

    The word "indorsement" IS used in U.S. English, although likely restricted to those in certain trades (business, banking, law, etc.)

    (I'm a native English speaker, and law student.)

    The word "indorsement" is mainly used within the legal context. See UCC Article 3, section 204. I've seen it mostly within the negotiable instrument context, and Black's law dictionary defines it as "the placing of a signature...on the back of a negotiable instrument...to transfer...the instrument."

    Oddly, my materials *do* interchange their usage (especially when verbing - i.e., indorsing an instrument, vs. endorsing an instrument.) And, the back of my checks say "endorsements here."

    Weird. But, I mainly wanted to note to learners of English that "indorsement" is very much in use, although much less common than "endorsement."
     
  16. englishjasmin

    englishjasmin Senior Member

    Slavic
    Indorsement means signing a document to make it legally acceptable. You can endorse a check by indorsing it. Indorsing a check is a subgroup of endorsing. You can not do an indorsement for George Bush (you would need to sign him to make him legal). An official could indorse G. Bush presidential campaign by signing some document that allows him to run.
     
  17. englishjasmin

    englishjasmin Senior Member

    Slavic
    My wife spent too much money last week. Although I don't endorse it, I indorsed the checks to save our marriage.

    ///One day later////

    Bank: Mr. Smith, did you endorse the check for £9000 to the local shoe shop? Your signature is a bit shaky, so we wanted to check.

    Mr. Smith: Thank you for calling. I was quite angry that my wife spent the money put aside for our mortgage. I do no endorse it, but I indorsed the check after all.
     
  18. Lazulilasher Junior Member

    English, United States
    Yep, you and the poster above captured the usage perfectly. "I do not endorse it, but I indorsed the check after all," sums it up well.
     
  19. JulianStuart

    JulianStuart Senior Member

    Sonoma County CA
    English (UK then US)
    Just to summarize for clarity :

    endorse has a range of meanings, one of which is "signing the back of a check etc."

    indorse only ever has the one meaning ("the placing of a signature...on the back of a negotiable instrument...to transfer...the instrument.").
     
  20. FlexTech New Member

    Utah
    English
    For legal purposes, such terms are applied to the formation of contracts and transferability (especially subsequent transfers that require indorsements) to be held as negotiable instruments. From what I've read in everyone's responses, there is a high degree of unawareness that indorsed/indorsement is factual and fitting in common U.S. English. However, some have provided credible insight as to the correct application for each. For those who have claimed no such word exists because you weren't able to find it in your pocket dictionary, I would suggest you invest in a more credible and modern version.

    Though endorse and indorse are often used interchangeably, each hold their rightful place based on the context they are being used. For example, an indorsement refers to validating the legal transfer of title by way of signatures. Conversely, endorsement alludes to one who is simply recommending the validity of a particular action or service, but without expression through use of signatures and guarantees. The use of indorsements do require signatures, which in-turn, generate a negotiable instruments' transferability, applicable liability, and a wide variety of complex circumstances and stipulations, which would probably require retaining an attorney to prove dishonor or unqualified indorsement status.

    For practical purposes, the use of indorsement is commonly applied to legal doctrine but is actually applied to everyday experiences, such as the financial industry: banking and lending institutions, etc. For in-depth understanding of the appropriate use of indorsement, I would encourage you to research its underlying definition and application(s) to the legal environment, particularly the Revised UCC Article [3-204(1-4)]. Though indorsement is mainly a legal definition, you'd be surprised how it's application is noted in our everyday lives, stemming from modern law that outlines the use of indorsements in commercial transactions. Hopefully this helps clarify, though I know my reply is rather broad and may not address the question you're seeking answers for.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2013
  21. trippleR New Member

    Filipino
    I had this argument with one person who always want to use not so familiar word than using much simpler one. He said that as a graduate of law, he will sound stupid if he uses ordinary words.
    He wrote an endorsement letter for my mother who appeals to our city mayor for a prosthetic leg.
    The letter says on its heading "INDORSEMENT LETTER"
    I told his wife who happens to be his secretary that I think the word INDORSEMENT is incorrect.
    He showed me several dictionaries stating that INdorsement and ENdorsement were just the same.
    He also pointed out that only person with minimum education like me will use the word ENdorsement rather than INdorsement (well I am a registered engineer and he thinks that he has a higher education than me).
    Please help me.
     
  22. panjandrum

    panjandrum PongoMod

    Belfast, Ireland
    English-Ireland (top end)
    Hello trippleR and welcome to WordReference.

    If you read this thread from the beginning, as I have just done, you will see that a number of people draw a careful distinction between endorse and indorse.
    Post #20 sets this out quite clearly.
    Following that, the letter is an endorsement letter, and may have been indorsed by the person who signed it.
    One thing is sure, though. The people who use indorse/indorsement are convinced that this is not the same as endorse/endorsement.

    But in the circumstances, where this man is doing you a favour, I suggest you swallow your pride and accept his letter with thanks. And anyway, if the spelling is wrong, it is his spelling, not yours :)
     

Share This Page