Es entsteht dabei

Discussion in 'Deutsch (German)' started by Soarinxg32, Jan 1, 2014.

  1. Soarinxg32

    Soarinxg32 Senior Member

    The following is from 2 videogame manuals;

    German manual:
    Du kannst diesen Spiegel nehmen, um aus der Schatten- in die Lichtwelt zu flüchten. Es entsteht dabei eine Art Tunnel, den Du auch wieder zurück benutzen kannst.

    English manual:
    Magical Mirror
    You can use this mirror to escape from the Dark World to the Light World. The portal that is created can also be used as a gate back into the Dark World.

    My attempt at a translation of the German part:
    Magical Mirror
    You can use this mirror to escape from the Dark World into the Light World. It originates close by a kind of tunnel that you can also again back use can.
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2014
  2. Dan2

    Dan2 Senior Member

    US English
    Time after time you do this and time after time it confuses me: The above is total "word salad" in English. I can understand your having trouble understanding the German; I can understand your making an error in translation, but how can this be the attempt at an English translation on the part of a native speaker of English?

    Thanks for any clarification.

    Edit: as for "entsteht dabei": I understand it as: "In this way a kind of tunnel is created..."
  3. grafkoks Banned

    "dabei" im Sinne von "dadurch, daß man den Spiegel benutzt". Using the mirror, a tunnel is created.
  4. Soarinxg32

    Soarinxg32 Senior Member

    I would like to thank you all in advance for the responses I have received so far.

    In trying to break down the sentence that has me confused, I get:

    Es = It
    entsteht =
    originates, arises, emerges
    dabei =
    nearby; with it
    eine Art Tunnel, =
    a kind of tunnel,
    den Du auch =
    that you also
    wieder = again
    zurück =
    benutzen kannst. =
    can use

    I understand that basically the sentence is trying to say somehow that A type of tunnel appears which you can also use to get back again into the Dark World, but I do not see the preposition zu in the German sentence, and I do not think omitting prepositions in German is correct.

    Also I am curious as to how Es entsteht dabei can mean In this way (blank) is created... when I have never seen this expression defined this way in any paperback dictionary, nor any online dictionaries anywhere on the internet. Your understanding of words is one thing but I like to go by officially written publications of the definitions of words from legitimate sources like Larousse or Duden, for I doubt they would just print one of your definitions into their dictionaries just like that without some professional verification beforehand...
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014
  5. grafkoks Banned

    Wo sollte denn die Präposition "zu" stehen, Deiner Meinung nach? Für mich ist das ein grammatikalisch korrekter Satz.
  6. grafkoks Banned

  7. berndf Moderator

    German (Germany)
    I share Grafkoks bewilderment. Where any why do you want to insert the preposition zu?
  8. Soarinxg32

    Soarinxg32 Senior Member

    Maybe it was a mistake for me to have even asked this question.

    3. im Verlaufe von, währenddessen, gleichzeitig
    sie nähte und hörte Musik dabei

    What does this random, haphazard example have anything to do with the question I posed above?

    Perhaps I should study German grammar books before trying to read video game manuals and such in German so as to get a better understanding of grammar first, then maybe I won't have so many questions...
  9. berndf Moderator

    German (Germany)
    He tried to tell you which of the many meanings of dabei is the relevant one in the given context.

    BTW, my question in #7 was meant seriously. I really don't understand your point. And if you explain it to me, I might help you resolve your misunderstanding... And I am rather confident there is one.
  10. Dan2

    Dan2 Senior Member

    US English
    1. If you are looking for a "zu" to correspond to the red "into" above, note that the German says only that you can get back, not explicitly get back to the Dark World. So you shouldn't expect a German word corresponding to the English word.
    2. Probably more often than not, if there's a German preposition corresponding to English "(in)to", it's not "zu".
    Omitting a preposition in German where there is one in English is extremely common (because of the German case system): "mir" is often "to me", "dem Mann" "to the Mann", "des Mannes" "of the man", etc.
    We've seen this issue before, where several native speakers of one language or the other tell you how they understand a phrase and you remain skeptical because you can't find that exact definition of words in your dictionaries. What you're missing is that there is no one-to-one correspondence between the words of two different languages. Different languages divide up concepts in the world in different ways. A dictionary is a general guide, a starting point. Analogy: no book can be written telling how to fix every mechanical problem a car might suffer; a good mechanic uses experience and human intelligence to analyze unusual problems and devise a way to solve them. Language is extremely complex and only years of experience with a pair of languages will allow you to accurately translate between them in all cases.
    I learn languages in very unorthodox ways, so I won't tell you to go take a course in German, but it really seems that by "jumping right in" and trying to understand "real German" (as opposed to starting with some basic grammar and simple grammar-book text) you are suffering from a lack of knowledge of some important basic concepts. That, together with your skepticism when people try to help you, make you one of the most difficult "characters" I've encountered on WRF. :)
  11. Soarinxg32

    Soarinxg32 Senior Member

    I appreciate all the replies I got so far. ;)

    I was given additional information on another websites forum that:
    "der dabei entstandene Tunnel" hört sich für mich besser an.

    Putting together all the help I've received from this website as well, I came up with the following translation:

    You can use this mirror to escape/flee from the Dark World into the Light World. The kind/type of tunnel that is created/arises can also be used to get back [return]. (to the Dark World)
  12. Dan2

    Dan2 Senior Member

    US English
    I think the earlier suggestions (involving "a kind of tunnel") are more accurate. To see that your "the kind of" is distinctly different from "a kind of", consider:

    He planted a row of trees in front of his house, creating a kind of wall that prevented the house from being seen from the road.
    This is not a real wall, but something that serves a similar purpose. This is analogous to "eine Art Tunnel"/"a kind of tunnel". Your change above turns my sentence into:
    He planted a row of trees in front of his house, creating the kind of wall that prevented the house from being seen from the road.
    Can you see that this is less accurate?

    I'll also suggest something that may make it easier for you to understand "Es entsteht dabei". If you rearrange that to "Dabei entsteht", and interpret "dabei" as its English cognate "thereby" and "entsteht" as "comes into being" (one of your approved dictionary definitions:)), you get "Thereby comes into being a kind of tunnel..." I'm not suggesting this as good English wording, but it should help you understand how the German phrase is being used.
  13. Soarinxg32

    Soarinxg32 Senior Member

    I see what you mean. Essentially {a kind of tunnel} is inherently different from {the kind of tunnel} in that "a" being the indefinite article changes the nuance of the sentence.

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