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Freedom (eleutheria-leuteria)

Discussion in 'Ελληνικά (Greek)' started by Solle, Nov 14, 2012.

  1. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    Kalimera!

    Unfortunately, I do not speak Greek but I take part in a choir that sings popular and folk songs in Greek. In the songs lyrics, I often see two very similar words: eleutheria and leuteria. My choir colleagues tell me they both mean "freedom", with a style difference. But if so, how could they be used in one and the same text? I'm just very curious and indifferent to what I sing, so I should be most grateful for any explanation.
     
  2. Perseas Senior Member

    Athen
    Griechisch
    Actually, "λευτεριά" is a corrupted form of "ελευθερία". ελευθερία---> ελευθτεριά.
    Today we usually use "ελευθερία" when we refer to "freedom". "Λευτεριά", which is a term of the vernacular, is still in use but it was mainly used in the past.
     
  3. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    Kala euharisto!

    Thank you very much for a detailed explanation. I still wonder if these two word variations can be used in one and the same text (a song). It reads that Macedonia is "eleutheri", but people will remain "leuteria"...Is it possible?
     
  4. Perseas Senior Member

    Athen
    Griechisch
    I assure you both variations can be used in the same text :). And this mostly applies to a song which has rhyme.
     
  5. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    ἐλευθερία is Ancient Greek, and is also used it the variety of Modern Greek called katharevusa. λευτεριά is Modern Greek (dhimotiki). This is an example of how some katharevusa words have been adopted in (some would say: have invaded) the spoken language.
     
  6. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    Ah, yes, the rhyme, that explains much:) Thank you so much!
     
  7. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    How interesting! And what is katharevusa? Is it a dialect or a stylistic variety of Greek?
     
  8. adber010 Senior Member

    Stockholm
    Swedish
    In my dictionary Ελευθερία translates as "freedom" and λευτεριά as "liberty". So then the question becomes: what is the difference in english?
     
  9. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    Katharevusa is essentially an artificial language, an attempt to "purify" the spoken language by restoring some ancient words and grammatical constructions. It has traditionally been favoured by the Orthodox Church and by some (mainly right-wing) politicians.

    Dhimotiki is modern spoken Greek. It has been used by virtually all serious literary writers since at least the beginning of the 20th century.
     
  10. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    What an interesting linguistic situation, and still more interesting that the artificial "dialect" is not rejected by the native speakers.
     
  11. Perseas Senior Member

    Athen
    Griechisch
    "Ελευθερία" is an ancient word but my impression is that it never stopped being in use during the ages.

    I 'd like also to add that "λευτεριά" is used as a wish to pregnant women (to give a good childbirth) --> "καλή λευτεριά", and to people who are enslaved (to regain their freedom) --> "λευτεριά στον/στην name".
     
  12. shawnee

    shawnee Senior Member

    Melbourne
    English - Australian
    The reason that the relationship between Katharevousa and Modern Greek is fluid (hence the survival of Ελευθερία) is a result of the fact that Katharevousa was not quite an 'artificial' language as such. The OP is advised to check out a wiki on the subject for starters.
     
  13. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    I will, as I had no idea of this before, and now greatly interested:)
     
  14. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    A beautiful wish for both those who give a new life and who regain their own free life.
     
  15. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    It seems that "freedom" is wider in meaning and can denote both the moral and physical state of freedom while "liberty" refers to freedom from imprisonment, invasion. or another kind of political or social oppression.
     
  16. adber010 Senior Member

    Stockholm
    Swedish
    :thumbsup:
     
  17. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    In English "freedom" and "liberty" are virually synonyms. The main difference is that "freedom" is a native (Germanic) word and "liberty" is a Latin borrowing. In this sense I would think that "freedom" is (at least historically) like /lefterya/ (the "genuine" Neo-Greek form) and "liberty" is like /elefθeria/ (a "learned" borrowing from an ancient language).
     
  18. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    I take the liberty (sic) to disagree with this.
     
  19. velisarius Senior Member

    Greece
    British English (Sussex)
    Sorry to disagree with posts #15 and 16, but freedom and liberty in English are almost always synonymous. It's just that "liberty" belongs to a higher register, whereas "freedom" is the more usual and colloquial word to use. Both anyhow are normally translated in modern Greek as "ελευθερία".

    "Ελευθερία ή θάνατος"- "Freedom/Liberty or Death"
     
  20. Solle

    Solle Junior Member

    Moscow
    Russian
    Ah, yes, this quote shows I was too categorical. Perhaps the difference is really just in style.
     
  21. Live2Learn Junior Member

    English - USA
    Those who have said that freedom and liberty are virtually or almost synonymous are probably referring to meaning, not to use. There are numerous examples where one is used rather than the other. Take the following collocations as just some examples:

    freedom from discrimination, scrutiny, etc.
    freedom of choice, expression, inquiry, movement, speech, the press
    freedom to practice, to think, to choose (cf. be at liberty to...)
    religious freedom
    political freedom
    economic freedom
    intellectual freedom
    relative freedom
    ...bought their freedom
    ...will be given their freedom
    ...serve the cause of freedom
    ...an indication of the freedom afforded by the outdoors

    For those who are interested in exploring similar topics, I recommend the following site: www.wordandphrase.info.
     
  22. Live2Learn Junior Member

    English - USA
    I actually should have said, "There are numerous examples where one TENDS TO BE used more than the other." For example a Google search of "economic freedom" yields 5,000,000 hits while "economic liberty" produces only 469,000 hits; "Freedom of choice" gives 7,030,000 hits, while "liberty of choice" gives only 399,000.
     
  23. fdb Senior Member

    Cambridge, UK
    French (France)
    ....whereby the variant with "liberty" tends to be more colourful or of more elevated style.
     

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