Hago saber a los que la presente vieren

Discussion in 'Legal Terminology' started by starredondo, May 7, 2006.

  1. starredondo Senior Member

    Raleigh, NC
    English USA
    I'm translating a Mexican birth certificate into English, and am looking for the gist of the above phrase.

    Here's the whole sentence: "En nombre del Estado Libre and Soberano de Morelos y como Oficial del Registro Civil de este lugar, hago saber a los que la presente vieren, y Certifico que en el Libro Núm.___ del Registro Civil que es a mi cargo, a la foja ____ se encuentran asentados los datos siguientes..."

    Any suggestions?

    Thanks!!
     
  2. Hidrocálida

    Hidrocálida Senior Member

  3. estrellafugz New Member

    U.S., English
    any more luck with the birth certificate translating? I'm wondering about the same phrase "hago saber a los que la presente vieren" in a birth certificate from colima...
    also- "los datos fueron asentados...los cuales se encuentran en el archivo de esta Oficialia a mi cargo."
     
  4. the boss Senior Member

    Mexico
    Mexico
    "such information was entered / recorded ..... which are (porque creo que se refiere a los libros en donde se asentaron los datos) filed in the archives of this Office of the civil records"

    la otra frase yo la diría "Be it known to all who have seen it".

    Ojalá te sirva
     
  5. estrellafugz New Member

    U.S., English
    Entonces, Boss-
    No piensas que es necesario mantener la forma de "yo" que usa?
    Por ejemplo en decir "Que los datos que a continuacion transcribo, fueron asentados"...."en el archivo de esta Oficialia a mi cargo" .....o el de "hago saber a los que la presente vieren y certifico"
    La verdad es que suena un poco raro en ingles tener "I make known and certify" when it is something more general and anonymous. Pero veo como usted lo cambio al 3a persona.
    Solamente curiosa...
    y gracias
     
  6. the boss Senior Member

    Mexico
    Mexico
    Interesante punto. Quizá la razón por la que en paises hispano parlantes o con influencia iusromanista se emplea siempre las formas con "YO" se deban precisamente a la herencia que en ese sentido legó el derecho romano.

    definitivamente suena muy raro el "yoismo" en inglés, razón por la que casi siempre se decide emplear la tercera persona como una forma imperativa de hacer ver las cosas. "Yo inscribo" - "inscríbase"

    Por una parte sería bueno tratar de mantener la forma original de redacción, que casi siempre debe cuidarse. Sin embargo, en el caso específico estimo que debe hacerse entendible para quien leera la traducción, no solo literal sino conceptualmente.

    El "yoismo" en castellano equivale en mucho al imperativo en tercera persona en inglés.

    Just an idea
     
  7. David Senior Member

    "Hago saber a los que la presente vieren,"

    Be it known to all to whom these presents may come...
     
  8. Smitch18 Senior Member

    Mexico
    English, U.K.
    Sorry, just quoting the last post, nothing to do with the post in itself. I think there's a cultural thing going on here which is reflected in the language. It's the difference between an institution which follows a given procedure and is anonymous versus an institution which has a boss who says what goes or doesn't. In the 'Anglo-Saxon' world, for want of a better phrase, you are made to feel that you are dealing with an institution in itself, while in the 'Latin' world (for want of a better phrase), you are made to feel that, ultimately, you are dealing with an individual who has the power to decide - 'La Licenciada Tal o El Licenciado Tal'; hence, in my humble opinion, the tendency to use first-person pronouns and the tendency towards corruption.
     
  9. David Senior Member

    Not sure of your point, but reading my post of five years ago, long forgotten, it looks right on to me.
    The translation of the formulaic preamble to a certification of some kind ought to be translated with a similar equivalent phrase. "Hago saber..." in this case is a formula, and has nothing to do with some "tendency towards corruption."
     
  10. Fruche Senior Member

    Spanish from Peru and Australian English
    On behalf of the sovereign State of Morelos and as officer of its Civil Registry, I let it be known to all interested parties, and I certify that ...

    I would not put anything about "... to whom presents may come" In English that doesn't make sense in the context of the text, even in legalesse it wouldn't make sense. Translate it into plain English giving the accurate meaning of the original language. If you want to translate the verbosity of the Spanish legalesse, then do it accurately and carefully, you don't want to confuse the reader.

    Cheers

    Fruche
     
  11. k-in-sc

    k-in-sc Senior Member

    (legalese)
    A birth certificate in the first person sounds bizarre to me too, and I find Smitch's theory interesting, but at the end of the day I don't think it matters whether you translate it literally or with boilerplate that sounds more natural to us English speakers, because nobody official cares about the wording of the document, just the facts of the person's birth.
     

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