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Icelandic: Þar þarf

Discussion in 'Nordic Languages' started by ShakeyX, Sep 9, 2013.

  1. ShakeyX Senior Member

    British English
    I know before on this forum I have brought up the normal passive, using both verbs that govern the accusative and the dative. I think I am familiar with that.. also I have witnessed the new passive (just correct me if i'm wrong but that takes "Ég var beðinn" into "það var beðið mig" Right??) which are semantically both the same... right? Please someone just check me on that cause I'm unsure.

    Anyway I saw this when filling out some forms online when I forgot to fill out everything and clicked submit.

    Það þarf að fylla út þessa liði!

    Now I know this must be some funky version of the passive but it's unrecognizable to me as of now. Það er þurft or something similar would of registered but this structure I am unsure about. Is it specific? How and why do I construct it.

    Thanks


    PS. Sorry I can't edit the tittle, it should ofcourse be það þarf
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2013
  2. Alxmrphi Senior Member

    Reykjavík, Ísland
    UK English
    Kórrekt.
    Nope, not passive.
    It's like how mega works or eiga with the active meaning. We only have an option of translating this as a passive in English, doesn't mean it's passive in Icelandic. ;)

    Það má ekki reykja - Smoking is not permitted
    Hvernig á maður að gera þetta? - How should this be done?
    Það þarf að fylla þetta út - This needs to be filled in

    It's just saying 'it needs' and then what has to be done.
    Simples ;)
     
  3. NoMoreMrIceGuy Senior Member

    Kallinge, Sweden
    Icelandic
    Please don't ever use this.
     
  4. ShakeyX Senior Member

    British English
    Want to add some reasoning as to why not?
     
  5. Alxmrphi Senior Member

    Reykjavík, Ísland
    UK English
    We talked about it in the other thread.
    It's not deemed good usage. I guess it can be hard to look at new languages and have someone say one thing sounds fantastic and another thing sounds horrible.
    There are plenty of things that people say in English, somewhere, dialectally or whatever, that you would probably recommend them not to use in writing. This is just one of those things in Icelandic. If you want to pass an exam to test your language skills, this very well could get you a big red cross next to it as an indication you don't know how to form the real passive.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2013
  6. NoMoreMrIceGuy Senior Member

    Kallinge, Sweden
    Icelandic
    I frankly don't know whether it's grammatically correct or not, but either way it sounds horrible. It sounds just as bad as if you would say "it was asked me" in English.
     
  7. Donnerstag Senior Member

    Reykjavik, Iceland
    Icelandic
    This is the so called "nýja þolmynd". Here's a paper (in Icelandic) about it: www.arnastofnun.is/solofile/1011098

    I'd advise you never to use it. Most speakers find it very ungrammatical and downright ugly. For me, it's like the sound of fingernails scraping chalkboard
     
  8. ShakeyX Senior Member

    British English
    Yeh I would never think to use it myself, out of curiosity, is it often used in the spoken language, just so I know if I have to look out for it and understand the meaning.

    And back to my original point, I do get the meaning, but the fact that "Það þarf að fylla út þessa liði!" has no subject does this kindof construction have no special name or reason. Is the það classed as a dummy subject or what?
     
  9. Alxmrphi Senior Member

    Reykjavík, Ísland
    UK English
    It has a subject just as much as it needs to be done has one.
    Yes, dummy pronoun (~impersonal construction in terminology relating to Icelandic).
    Same idea in both languages.
     

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