insist (insistir) - he insisted that I go/went

Discussion in 'Spanish-English Grammar / Gramática Español-Inglés' started by mr.pt, Nov 9, 2012.

  1. mr.pt New Member

    Español,España
    Hola a todos! Soy nuevo en el foro y aprovecho para presentarme.

    Estoy teniendo algunos problemas con el verbo insistir, y aunque buscando por el foro he llegado a algunas conclusiones, no me aclaro del todo.

    Por ejemplo, la frase: "El insiste en que vaya al médico".
    Se traduciría por "He insists that i go to the doctor".

    Hablando en pasado, "El insistió en que fuera al médico".
    Yo lo traduciría por "He insisted that i ¿go/went? to the doctor". Es decir, ¿tengo que conjugar el verbo to go o no?

    Y lo mismo con la forma "He insists on me going to the doctor"
    "He insisted on me going/were going to the doctor".

    Muchas y gracias y un saludo!!
     
  2. ClimbEveryMountain

    ClimbEveryMountain Senior Member

    Murray, KY
    Español
    Por cierto, en respuesta a tu primera pregunta... solo cambias el verbo insist a pasado, pero el verbo que viene a continuación no cambia porque está en modo subjuntivo. El pasado del verbo insist no afecta el subjuntivo.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2012
  3. James2000 Senior Member

    English - South Africa
    Some would insist that you use 'my' instead of 'me' in the last sentence, but both are used. It's a rule that falls into the same category as the 'no split infinitives' rule.
     
  4. kalamazoo Senior Member

    US, English
    In AmE, you would use the subjunctive, which is clear only for the third person. So I would say "I insisted that he go to the doctor". I have a feeling that in BrE in which the subjunctive seems to be dying, that might not be acceptable but I will leave it up to speakers of BrE to comment.
     
  5. Chris K Senior Member

    Tacoma WA, US
    English / US
    Note la diferencia entre:

    He insisted that he go to the doctor. (El insistió en que fuera al médico.)
    He insisted that he went to the doctor. (El insistió en que [ya, de hecho] fue al médico.)
     
  6. ClimbEveryMountain

    ClimbEveryMountain Senior Member

    Murray, KY
    Español
    Hola Chris K.

    Muy válida y apropiada la diferencia.

    Para mr.pt, quiero hacer una ampliación del tema usando los pronombres que tú usaste en la pregunta para hacerlo más claro.

    En español: Él insistió en que yo fuera al médico= He insisted that I go to the doctor
    Él insistió en que yo fui al médico= He insisited that I went to the doctor

    En el primero hay un sentido de recomendación y sugerencia. Como cuando le recomiendas varias veces a un amigo que haga algo.
    En el segundo hay un sentido de "reafirmación" de algo que ya se había dicho. Te pongo un ejemplo: Estás en una corte, un testigo te está acusando de algo y para ello, reitera una y otra vez que tú sí fuiste el médico, aunque tú has dicho que no.

    Espero que notes la diferencia entre las dos oraciones que puso Chris K.
     
  7. mr.pt New Member

    Español,España
    Ok. Muy bien explicado, me habéis sacado de dudas.
    Gracias a todos!
     
  8. unoo New Member

    Español
    Is it correct to use this form?

    Shouldn't we use the verb "insist" as an intransitive verb?
    For intance: He insisted on going to the doctor?


    Feel free to correct any mistake I could make.
     
  9. Chris K Senior Member

    Tacoma WA, US
    English / US
    It doesn't matter what you insist on; you still use the same form, and "insist on" is always transitive:

    He insisted on going to the doctor [that is, himself] / he insisted on me going to the doctor / he insisted on my going to the doctor.
     
  10. robjh22 Senior Member

    U.S.A. & English
    Actually, "insist" is always intransitive.

    Not sure that "insist on" can be called transitive or intransitive in and of itself. I think it's a "verb phrase," isn't it?
     
  11. SevenDays Senior Member

    Spanish
    "Insist" can be transitive or intransitive, depending on how it's used. If it's followed by a noun-like that-clause, it's transitive, where the that-clause functions as the object: he insists that I go the doctor. If "insist" is constructed with a prepositional phrase, then it's intransitive: he insisted upon a different course of action; he insisted on my going to the doctor. Now we enter into the quick-sand world of terminology. English has this characteristic that verbs readily combine with prepositions to form idiomatic expressions. Some call phrasal verbs those verb + preposition combinations that resist separation; that is, they are fixed in place (he broke with tradition). By contrast, those combinations that can be separated are called, by some, prepositional verbs (She gave away most of her money; She gave most of her money away). In this sense, "insist on" is a phrasal verb, unless you call this construction "he insisted desperately on my going to the doctor" idiomatic, in which case "insists on" becomes a prepositional verb. As phrasal verb, "insist on" is transitive; it needs a complement to complete its meaning. So, there's the rub: "insist" as intransitive verb, with a prepositional phrase complement, or "insist on" as transitive phrasal verb, with a noun or something functioning as noun as its complement. It all depends on your perspective. Welcome to the wonderful world of terminology. By the way, verb phrase is simply the verb plus all its complements.
    Cheers
     

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