la chose vue (philosophie)

Discussion in 'French-English Vocabulary / Vocabulaire Français-Anglais' started by maria vecchi, Nov 29, 2011.

  1. maria vecchi Senior Member

    Hello, this is a technical/philosophical term useful when you discuss cinema. Unfortunately, I haven't found any English translation, and I am not comfortable with "the thing seen". There is a perfect equivalent in Italian but I believe the original expression was coined in French.
    Are there any film geeks who can help me? Thanks a lot.
  2. lucas-sp Senior Member

    English - Californian
    What schools of film theory/film theorists use this term? Most importantly, what is "la chose vue" opposed to? What is its definition?

    My first guess is "imaginary signifier," but that's clearly not right. Perhaps just "the screen-image," or "the image-object"?
  3. maria vecchi Senior Member

    Actually, I thought that it basically meant "reality". The object of the camera's gaze.
  4. lucas-sp Senior Member

    English - Californian
    See, that would be "the thing in itself," or "la chose en soi." I just doubt that that's "la chose vue." If you had an example in context, we could discuss the precise meaning of "la chose vue" - to me, it seems intuitive that it refers to the image of the thing, and not to the thing itself (which would obviously go unseen in itself because its image would be seen instead).
  5. maria vecchi Senior Member

    I can only quote the sentence in Italian from the text I am working on. I chose to ask the French-English forum because I am sure that the referenced expression was first coined in French. Let me know if you can read Italian ok?
    "Il dato di partenza, quindi, si trova a oscillare fra un’immagine che sembra metterne in discussione il suo dato di realtà e un’altra nella quale la qualità quasi ipnotica della ripresa sembra amplificare la cosa vista. "
    My translation (1st draft): "The factual datum, then, hangs between an image that seems to question its factualness and another where the almost hypnotic quality of the take seems to amplify the 'chose vue'."
  6. lucas-sp Senior Member

    English - Californian
    Is the author working with Deleuze? Maybe you should look at how "the subjective-image" is translated into English.
  7. maria vecchi Senior Member

    That is entirely possible. I'll check my Deleuze and I'll let you know.
    It was nice talking to you.
  8. lucas-sp Senior Member

    English - Californian
    I mean, I don't want to go too far into the Italian, because it's outside of this forum's scope, but the question appears to be based on the object's "flight" from representation, leaving behind the oscillation of two images: one which radically questions the reality of the object itself, and another in which the image itself (and not the thing behind the image), thanks to the almost hypnotic form of the camerawork, swells to occupy the entire screen.
  9. maria vecchi Senior Member

    Thank you for your insightful interpretation. I'll keep on searching and get back to you when I find some source.

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