le/lo quiero mostrar

Discussion in 'Spanish-English Grammar / Gramática Español-Inglés' started by ascension, Apr 9, 2008.

  1. ascension

    ascension Senior Member

    New York
    English-United States
    Good morning!

    This questions comes from posts 7 and 8 of this thread:
    http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=906196

    Somebody wrote "Venga aquí, te quiero mostrar mi ciudad" and the correction was "venga aquí, le quiero mostrar mi ciudad."

    I understand why it needs to be formal instead of informal, but I don't understand why it is indirect and not direct.

    I'm almost certain that when querer means 'to love' you can say 'lo/la quiero'. That makes me think that the reason that 'le' is used is because there is another verb. Is that right?

    Thanks.
     
  2. Liax Senior Member

    Madrid
    Spanish (Spain)
    You have to ask yourself:
    - What do I want?
    - "mostrar la ciudad". That's the direct object
    - "to whom?
    - " A usted" I mean "le". That's the indirect object.

    Hope it helps
     
  3. mnewcomb71 Senior Member

    Detroit, MI
    USA - English
    Liax has it correct...the le is the IO for mostrar.
     
  4. ascension

    ascension Senior Member

    New York
    English-United States
    Ohhh I see it. Thanks so much Liax and mnewcomb71, those are perfect explanations.

    If I understand correctly, then, it could also be "Se la quiero mostrar" where 'se' would be the IO for mostrar and 'la' would be the DO for querer. Is that correct?
     
  5. Liax Senior Member

    Madrid
    Spanish (Spain)
    That's correct. "Se la quiero mostrar"
    You've got it.
     
  6. mnewcomb71 Senior Member

    Detroit, MI
    USA - English
    The construction is correct, but not the reasoning behind it, at least not for me.

    Se la quiero mostrar = I want to show it to him (her, you).

    Subject = I
    verb = mostrar
    DO = la
    IO = se

    I do not even know if la could be the DO for querer while se is the IO for mostrar.

    If that were the case, it would read something like:

    I love it to show to you...and that kind of hurts my brain a little.
     
  7. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    Ese le está solo relacionado con usted:

    Encantado de conocerle. (a usted)

    Sería un placer poder visitarle. (a usted)
     
  8. ascension

    ascension Senior Member

    New York
    English-United States
    Thanks again Liax and mnewcomb.

    mnewcomb, I definitely see your point...I'm not really sure what I was thinking with that. Still, I understand the construction now and I really appreciate your help!
     
  9. ascension

    ascension Senior Member

    New York
    English-United States
    Ynez, thanks for the input, but I think I'm a bit confused. When you say it's only related to usted do you mean that it's the IO? Thanks!

    (Also, I'm really not sure about this, but aren't those cases of leismo? I'm obviously not a native speaker but I would have used 'lo' in both cases, so I'd appreciate a correction if I should really be using 'le'.)
     
  10. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    I thought of a particular example in which we'd use lo/la for third person, to show you exactly that: le is used in formally addressing people (second person singular) as usted:)

    Estoy encantado de conocerla (a ella)
    Estoy encantado de conocerlo (a él)...(In Spain we also say "conocerle" here)*

    Sería un placer poder visitarla (a ella)
    Sería un placer poder visitarlo (a él) * applies here too
     
  11. Liax Senior Member

    Madrid
    Spanish (Spain)
    "le" is used for indirect object, never "la" o "lo"
    "le" is allowed to use for direct object refered to people, but this isn't the case

    Hope it helps
     
  12. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    Venga aquí, le quiero mostrar mi ciudad = Come here, I want to show YOU my city
     
  13. mnewcomb71 Senior Member

    Detroit, MI
    USA - English
    Ynez...I do not understand your example in post #12. Which point were you trying to underline?
     
  14. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    mnewcomb71, let's go back to the original sentence in post 1. What do you think it's the meaning?

    My post 12 translated the sentence into English.
     
  15. mnewcomb71 Senior Member

    Detroit, MI
    USA - English
    Ohh...you were just translating the original sentence...I get it now. Sorry, I am a little slow at times. :)

    I completely agree with the translation, it was just that you translated it after some discussions of DO and IO pronoums and leísmo, as well as some examples, so I was a little lost.
     
  16. flljob

    flljob Senior Member

    México
    México español
    Le = se when followed by the DO
    Le muestro la ciudad = se la muestro
    Le doy un pan = se lo doy

    If I understand correctly, then, it could also be "Se la quiero mostrar" where 'se' would be the IO for mostrar and 'la' would be the DO for querer. Is that correct?

    The DO is se la quiero mostrar
    subject = (yo)
    Verb= quiero
    DO = mostrarle la ciudad
     
  17. Maximus07

    Maximus07 Senior Member

    Northern California
    English-U.S.A.

    I always say le in this case instead of la/lo. I assume that this is leismo right? Whenever i talk about el/ella/usted i use le for all of them. That is okay right? In the above example Ynez is using le just for the el form but could it be used for ella too?

    "Seria un placer poder visitarle (a ella) " Can i say that?


    Thankyou!

    Max
     
  18. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    My personal answer is Yes, you can say that ;)

    If you have a look at some of the threads relating the use of "lo/le/la", you'll see that many times we, native speakers, don't agree or use it differently.

    There are lots of native Spanish speakers who use this in a wrong way all the time, because it's the way it's used in their area (sometimes the area can mean their particular village, and in the next village the use is more standard).

    You risk sounding a little bit strange with some particular use, because maybe it's not normal that anybody at all would use it in that case.

    In the examples with conocer and visitar, in Spain one can hear all three options, so my opinion is again that you should feel free to use your favourite :)
     
  19. Maximus07

    Maximus07 Senior Member

    Northern California
    English-U.S.A.
    Thankyou :D Just one of those things that i can't pick up in school and that ill have to get off the street :D

    Max
     
  20. Ynez Senior Member

    Spain
    Spanish
    I truly think this is something very very hard to learn, even for native speakers :)
     
  21. ascension

    ascension Senior Member

    New York
    English-United States
    Thanks so much for this clarification Ynez!
     
  22. Maximus07

    Maximus07 Senior Member

    Northern California
    English-U.S.A.
    Now i just gotta learn the difference between atras detras and tras:D
     
  23. mnewcomb71 Senior Member

    Detroit, MI
    USA - English
    I agree with Ynez...very difficult to learn. I just go with it and whatever comes out comes out...even if it is wrong. I often add the "a Ud." or something at the end when there might be some confusion...
     

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