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ministrar y pastorear

Discussion in 'Spanish-English Vocabulary / Vocabulario Español-Inglés' started by flightgoddess, Aug 9, 2005.

  1. flightgoddess Senior Member

    Minneapolis, Minnesota
    US, English, Spanish
    Thanks for the help in my last posting. (Yes, I am a horrible speller and I rely heavily on spellcheck ;)

    the original: para ministrar las ordenanzas y ceremonias; pastorear la iglesia del senor.

    Neither is in any dictionary (they are made up or anglicized words?) so my feeling is that ministrar in this sense would be administer and pastorear would be minister?

    Mil gracias.
     
  2. Eugens

    Eugens Senior Member

    Argentina Spanish
    I think that your translations are correct. All words are made up, ultimately:p (in days gone by, someone had to have invented them). And those ones are not anglicized words...
     
  3. Eugens

    Eugens Senior Member

    Argentina Spanish
    According to the RAE:
    pastorear.

    1. tr. Llevar los ganados al campo y cuidar de ellos mientras pacen.
    2. tr. Dicho de un prelado: Cuidar vigilantemente de sus fieles, dirigirlos y gobernarlos.
    3. tr. C. Rica y Ur. vigilar.

    the meaning you are looking for is the second one
     
  4. Eugens

    Eugens Senior Member

    Argentina Spanish
    ministrar. (also from the RAE)
    (Del lat. ministrāre).
    1. tr. p. us. Servir o ejercer un oficio, empleo o ministerio. U. t. c. intr.
    2. tr. p. us. Dar, suministrar a alguien algo. Ministrar dinero, especies.
    3. tr. ant. administrar.
     
  5. JESUS MARIA

    JESUS MARIA Senior Member

    LEON-Spain
    SPAIN@ESPAÑOL
    Sorry, but maybe "ministrar" could be anglized word, or at least in spain is not used. As you´ve said ministrar means administrar in spanish.

    Perhaps in America is used minitrar, but in Spain no.
    Sorry for my english
     
  6. typistemilio

    typistemilio Senior Member

    Mérida, Yucatán, México
    México, D.F. Español-Spanish/Some of english/maaya t'aan
    Respetuosamente discrepo de la opinión de Jesús María.

    Aún cuando es cierto que no es muy frecuente, es una palabra propia del español, reconocida por la RAE, de origen latín, y de la cual provienen vocablos que aún se usan en ciertos círculos. Por ejemplo, se habla del "ministerio de salud", hay "primeros ministros", se dice que el pastor de una iglesia "ministra" a sus feligreses.

    ¡Saluditos!
     
  7. Aymee Bustinza

    Aymee Bustinza Junior Member

    Peru
    Peru, español
    Hola: se que es tarde, pero tal vez a alguien le sirva. En el contexto cristiano ministrar vendria a ser "to minister" o "to help" o "to serve", miestras que pastorear en este contexto no se refiere a algo de las ovejas, sino a cuidar, "to take care"
     
  8. 0scar Senior Member

    Furlan-Argjentine
    En este contexto pastorear se refiere a las ovejas, en sentido figurado. Es bíblico.

    En algunos casos es mejor núnca que tarde...
     
  9. DMichel Senior Member

    México, español
    I think, you are correct. Flightgoddess.

    ministrar in this sense would be administer and pastorear would be minister.
     
  10. 0scar Senior Member

    Furlan-Argjentine
    ¿Cuál es el otro "ambo" que tiene razón?

    Pastorear es cuidar a las ovejas y la entrada al foro peor tarde que núnca fue para negar que no se refiere a ovejas.

    BTW, ¿Por qué será que Jesucristo usó el látigo?
     
  11. Me Again Senior Member

    English -American
    I know this is an ancient thread, but in case anyone comes across it again, the way to translate pastorear la iglesia del senor is:

    to shepherd the Lord's church

    The word "minister" is not a correct translation for pastorear.
     
  12. Sephiroth_Leo New Member

    Argentina
    Spanish
    "Pastorear" es usado en el ámbito eclesiástico de forma metafórica.
    Por lo cual concuerdo con Me Again the usar la palabra Shepherd como verbo, creo que es la mejor opción.

    Con respecto a "ministrar", el sentido (en el caso de la oración en cuestión) es el de la segunda acepción de la RAE.
    2. tr. p. us. Dar, suministrar a alguien algo. Ministrar dinero, especies.

    El término se emplea en modo figurativo, refiriéndose al hecho que el pastor ministra (Da o suministra) el Espíritu Santo sobre los fieles.

    Basandome en la comparación de la Biblia en Español (Versión Reina Valera) con la Biblia en Inglés (versión King James), mi propuesta es la siguiente:

    To minister the regulations and ceremonies; to shepherd the Lord's church

    Espero le sirva a alguien, recién me percato de la antiguedad del post! =S
     
  13. Justham Senior Member

    Salt Lake City, UT
    USA-English
    aparte de eso: :thumbsup:
     
  14. Sephiroth_Leo New Member

    Argentina
    Spanish
    I was not so sure about "regulations". So, thanks! =)

    But the word "minister" (as verb) and its gerund "ministering" is frequently used by the Bible itself in the sense of "Ministrar" and in the sense of "Administrar"

    Thank you Justham
     
  15. Me Again Senior Member

    English -American
    That may be true. However, rites in particular cannot be "ministered". "Minister" is intransitive and cannot take an object. One cannot "minister something," but only "administer something." HTH.
     
  16. Sephiroth_Leo New Member

    Argentina
    Spanish
    Sometimes words in the eclesiastical world do not follow clear-cut rules. The Bible uses the verb "Minister" as intransitive and as transitive.

    Take the book of Romans (chapter 15, verse 16) as an example:

    "That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering (Transitive verb) the gospel of God (Verb Object), that the offering up of the Gentiles might be acceptable, being sanctified by the Holy Spirit."
     
  17. Me Again Senior Member

    English -American
    I stand corrected! Thank you. :)

    As a native speaker who has read the Bible and done translation work in the area of Christianity, I still have to say that one would need to use "administer the rites and ordinances" and not "minister". It just doesn't sound right. Fine for a Bible translator to use it and it has a poetic feel to it, but when written in everyday English for everyday people, "minister" makes it sound like it's written by a non-native speaker.

    In the cited Scripture from Romans, it would be impossible to use "administer." One cannot "administer" the gospel of God. But rites are administered. Ceremonies, on the other hand, are commonly "performed."
     
  18. Sephiroth_Leo New Member

    Argentina
    Spanish
    Oh, now I get what you mean.

    You're right, thank YOU!

    I've just taken for granted that this kind of translation would be aimed to Christian people, who may be used tot his kind of words.

    But you're totally right in saying "minister makes it sound like it's written by a non-native speaker"

    Thank you again!
     

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