Nested Idafa Adjectives

Discussion in 'العربية (Arabic)' started by yesag1, Mar 20, 2013.

  1. yesag1 New Member

    English - England
    Hello.

    I have a question regarding the genitive structure (idafa) and adjectives. I have been studying it thus far via books and websites, and everything seems straight forward, but there seems to be a lack of resources regarding complex nested idafa structures and adjectives. For example:

    The door of the car of the student.

    بَابُ السَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ

    The new door of the car of the student.

    بَابُ السَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ الْجَدِيدُ

    I understand the placement of the adjective in the above sentences (correct me if I'm wrong though).

    How would one go about saying something slightly more complex though? For example:

    The new door of the dirty car of the ugly student.

    My attempt:

    بَابُ السَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ الْقَبِيحِ الْوَسِخَةِ الْجَدِيدُ

    Sorry if masculine/feminine is off.

    Thanks.
     
  2. ahmedcowon Senior Member

    Your placement of iDafa and adjectives is correct but in iDafa, only the last word takes the definite article

    بَابُ سَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ

    بَابُ سَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ الْجَدِيدُ

    بَابُ سَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ الْقَبِيحِ الْوَسِخَةِ الْجَدِيدُ


    this is an example of nested iDafa:
    بابُ سيارةِ مديرِ مدرسةِ شارعِ السلامِ
     
  3. yesag1 New Member

    English - England
    Thanks ahmedcowon. I get it now. :thumbsup:
     
  4. إسكندراني

    إسكندراني Senior Member

    أرض الأنجل
    عربي (مصر)ـ | en (gb)
    In practice you wouldn't use an Idafa all the way thruogh with this many adjectives:
    الباب الجديد لسيارة الطالب القبيح الوسخة
     
  5. yesag1 New Member

    English - England
    Hello friend. Can you elaborate further on "in practice"? I take it that it is technically it is correct but that nobody speaks like that? What structure is the alternative? The example that you gave?

    Also, sorry but I'm not strong enough to fully understand an Arabic sentence without vowels/grammar, so could you either translate that sentence for me, or repost it with the vowels? (I get the words, but not the structure).

    Bless you.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2013
  6. jack_1313 Senior Member

    English - Australian
    There are a few key things to remember.

    The first is that each adjective must match the word it modifies in the إضافة structure in definiteness and (obviously) gender, plurality etc. In a definite إضافة structure - ie one in which the last term takes an ال or is a proper noun - all terms are considered definite. In an indefinite إضافة, all terms are considered indefinite.

    The adjectives should appear in the reverse order of the terms of the إضافة structure. So an adjective modifying the last term will appear first and so on. You can see this in admedcowon's example:
    بَابُ سَّيَّارَةِ الطَّالِبِ الْقَبِيحِ الْوَسِخَةِ الْجَدِيدُ
    1 2 3 - 3 2 1

    Finally, sometimes and entire إضافة structure can be used as an adjective, including as an adjective that modifies a term in another إضافة structure. In those cases, some other rules apply.
     

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