Discussion in 'Русский (Russian)' started by alavalen, Nov 18, 2012.
we like to have people over for lunch.
we often have people over to eat.
And what is your question? What the function and the meaning of the word "over" are in your sentences?
If so, it is a preposition and the definition is described here (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/over) under prep. #13, i.e., "While occupied with or engaged in" (e.g.: a chat over coffee).
I don`t think this is a correct example. I`ve realized that in my sentences "have over" should be translade- приглашаю. Do you agree?
приглашать к себе
We had my boss over to/for supper yesterday (= my boss came to our place for supper)
We had my wife's parents over (to stay) last Christmas (= they came to stay at our place)
I invited my friend over for the weekend (= invited him/her to stay the weekend at my place).
We like to have people over for lunch (= we like to invite people to our place for lunch)
(note: "over" must come after the object , it cannot come after the verb:
We like to have over people for lunch )
Well, I thought you asked about the word "over", its meaning or what it does in those sentences, didn't you? And if so, I think that that dictionary example I gave is perfectly correct. That is, the preposition works in all the three sentences the same way.
Yes, in Russian we can't use\handle the verb have the way we do in English and we normally need to substitute it with the closest Russian verb depending on the context. So, in Russian we'd say something like Мы любим приглашать людей в гости на ужин\Мы любим приглашать гостей к нам на ужин, rather than Мы любим иметь людей (у нас в гостях) за ужином\Мы любим иметь гостей у нас за ужином . But it has absolutely nothing to do with the preposition "over", i.e. if we would use the verb "to invite" instead of "to have" the preposition "over" would still be there. (e.g.: "We like to invite people over for lunch", "We often invite people over to eat").
"Over" mayby emphasizes the fact how often you invite guests - Мы частенько приглашаем гостей. Am I right?
No, over has nothing to do with the frequency, here. "To have somebody over for something (lunch, dinner)" is just an idiom.
Я бы сказал, over тут появилось в значении движения откуда-то куда-то (через что-то, например, забор, дорогу, холм) на небольшое расстояние. Всякий раз, когда слышу его, представляю, как рукой воздух загребают - мол, заходите к нам! А вот пригласить "over" из-за границы уже, по-моему, не получится: расстояние не то.
Я так не думаю. Мне тут видится два варианта: over как в уже приведенном мной постами выше словарном определении "While occupied with or engaged in" или "at one's place". Т.е. например, если кто-нибудь скажет мне что-нибудь типа I'd like to invite her for dinner я в первую очередь предположу, что речь идет о приглашении в какое-нибудь заведение (кафе, ресторан), в то время как фраза I'd like to invite her over for dinner даст мне понять, что речь идет о приглашении домой (на домашний ужин). Я могу ошибаться разумеется, но "какгрится" чем богаты..
No, unfortunately you are not.
You are both right - these are three distinct meanings of the word "over".
An example: "Come over to the window my little darling, I'd like to try to read your palm ..." ('So Long, Marianne' - Leonard Cohen)
* Example: That's a great idea, let's discuss it over dinner.
**I'd like to invite her over for dinner даст мне понять, что речь идет о приглашении домой (на домашний ужин).
Enquiring Mind, thank you very much for your clarification!
Well, I still think in this example, from the original post, the whole phrase is just an idiom, and the meaning of "over" is really of no importance.
While "having someone over" may be idiomatic, I think it is important to note that an alternate meaning of the preposition "over" is to express the combined idea of movement across with arrival at a location. This is the same use of "over" that is used when asking someone across the room to "come over here," or when telling someone near you to "go over there." When you invite someone "over" it is short for inviting them to "come over" to your location, i.e your house.
(izvenite, chto eto po-angliski. u menia net ruskogo «keyboard setting»--i tozhe, ruskii yazik pochti sovsyem zabila. )
Apologies also if my post is similar to what was already posted by Sobaksu. The Russian сюда and туда certainly came to my mind, in thinking of this use of "over." Unfortunately, my Russian is too rusty to fully understand the post.
Separate names with a comma.