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Past tense

Discussion in 'Čeština (Czech)' started by lonelyheartsclubband, Dec 12, 2005.

  1. lonelyheartsclubband Junior Member

    Israel, Rishon
    Russian, Hebrew: Israel
    I would like to know who does it look like. I have heard that in Czech language the Past Tense differs a lot from the Past Tense of Russian.
    What are the rules of conjugating the verbs in Czech Past Tense?
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. Jana337

    Jana337 Senior Member

    čeština
    Hello :)

    I actually believe that the Czech and the Russian past tenses are quite similar. The only substantial difference is that we, quite illogically, use an auxiliary verb (to be) in the first two persons. Please go through this post in another thread and tell me what, if anything, strikes you as noteworthy :)

    Looking forward to follow-up questions!

    Jana
     
  3. Tchesko

    Tchesko Senior Member

    Paris 12
    Czech
    Hi,

    Maybe that's not so illogical after all. If I remember it correctly, Russian needn't use an auxiliary verb because a personal pronoun is usually explicitly mentioned in the sentence. In Czech, you can omit the pronoun so you need an auxiliary verb to make the distinction between "I spoke" and "you spoke". In my opinion, the illogical thing is the disappearance of the auxiliary verb in the 3rd person (yet, it used to be there long, long ago).
    But I might get it wrong, as I haven't done any Russian for ages...

    Roman
     
  4. Jana337

    Jana337 Senior Member

    čeština
    My usage of the word "illogical" referred to the peculiarity of the 3rd person. :) What you wrote about Russian is correct as far as I know.

    But now I am curious. You wrote that the auxiliary verb used to be in the 3rd person long ago. I am unable to imagine a single example... Could you please show me some?

    Thanks,

    Jana
     
  5. lonelyheartsclubband Junior Member

    Israel, Rishon
    Russian, Hebrew: Israel
    It means that
    jsem mlovil - i spoke?
    Vy jste mlovili - you spoke?
    Oni mlovili - they spoke?
    Have I guessed correctly?
    I heard that the polish past tense reserves for each pronoun a special conjugation. Am I right?
    Thanks.
    Waiting for corrections.
     
  6. Jana337

    Jana337 Senior Member

    čeština
    I will edit the thread to attract Polish forer@s.

    Jana
     
  7. Tchesko

    Tchesko Senior Member

    Paris 12
    Czech
    Gladly:

    "Hospodin Bůh otců vašich rozmnožiž vás nad to, jakž jste nyní, tisíckrát více, a požehnej vám, jakož jest mluvil vám"
    (Bible kralická, Deuteronomium, 1. kapitola)

    "S nimi jest mluvil, tvrdost rozumu tresktal, a písma tajemstvie o sobě jest vyložil; a že v jich srdcích věrú jako pútník bieše, pořekl sě dále jíti, ne lživě, ale taký sě jim ukázal na těle, kteraký jest u nich byl v mysli. Pokúšeni sú měli býti, aby ti, jenž ho ne jako boha milovali, aspoň aby jako pútníka milovati mohli."
    (Jan Hus, Kázání po Veliké noci)

    "(...)
    teprv jest byl zdráv v životě svém;
    od vodyť jest on lékařstvie vzal,
    protož když jest proroka poslúchal.
    Kéž jeho jest víno uzdravilo,
    (...)

    (Svár vody s vínem)


    "Cožkoli mluvili, dobřeť jsou mluvili."
    (Bible kralická, Deuteronomium, 5. kapitola)


    There are many more examples - just type "jest" + a verb in past tense in Google...


    Of course, these texts are old. I did say it was long, long ago... :)
    However, I don't know why the auxiliary verb was sometimes used, sometimes not (as you can see in the examples).

    Roman
     
  8. Jana337

    Jana337 Senior Member

    čeština
    Many thanks! I was aware of this phenomenon but I never tried to think of it as a variant of "byli jsme" etc. :blush: It is nice to have foreigners who ask startling questions about our own mother tongue. :)

    I would love to know why the usage of the auxiliary verb is so random.

    Jana
     
  9. Tekeli-li! Tekeli-li! Junior Member

    Prague
    Czech | Czech Republic
    No offense, but wasn't "Svár vody s vínem" written in the 15th century? How can it be copyrighted?
     
  10. Jana337

    Jana337 Senior Member

    čeština
    Sorry, I just used my standard comment without thinking about it too much. :) Going to fix it.

    Our rules state that quotations should not exceed 4 sentences (which is interpreted as 4 lines for poems/lyrics/etc.). We tend to discourage any extensive quotations from web pages - and not only copyrighted material - because we believe that it is better to err on the side of caution (in the sense that many readers are not aware about the copyright issues in particular cases and tolerating long quotations would be a misleading signal).

    Jana
     
  11. Tchesko

    Tchesko Senior Member

    Paris 12
    Czech
    I endorse these rules.
    Obviously, "Svár vody s vínem" is not copyrighted. Moreover, the website where I took it from allows quoting. However, I agree 4 lines are enough...
    By the way, is http://citanka.cz/ on our resource sticky? There are some interesting texts on it.

    Roman
     

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