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Persian: She suddenly felt tired.

Discussion in 'Indo-Iranian Languages' started by seitt, Dec 8, 2013.

  1. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Greetings

    My sentence for translation:
    “His wife suddenly felt tired, so he took her home.

    Best wishes, and many thanks,

    Simon
     
  2. Treaty Senior Member

    Australia
    Persian
    Hi,

    Formal: همسرش ناگهان احساس خستگی کرد، پس اورا به خانه برد
    Informal: زنش یهو احساس خستگی کرد، پس بردش خونه
     
  3. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Colloquial (fairly joking and used just by near friends): زنش يهو تلنگش/جونش در رفت، بردش خونه
    Colloquial (fairly impolite): زنش يهو زپرتش قمصو﴿ر﴾ شد، بردش خونه
    Colloquial (very impolite): زنش يهو جون از كونش در رفت، بردش خونه
     
  4. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Thank you so much, such linguistic riches! (Though the poor wife may see it differently:D!)
    Please could you give me the exact pronunciation for this? I guess it's a punning mixture of زرتی (pronounced 'zerti', isn't it? It's just come up in another thread.) and زرتش قمصو﴿ر﴾ شد - do you agree with my analysis?
     
  5. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Yeho Zepertesh Ghamsoo(r) shod.

    To be honest, I have not any idea at all. I just can say زرتش is wrong and I have not heard it to now in any conversation.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2013
  6. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
  7. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Whoops, I nearly missed this one: how is تلنگ pronounced, please?

    And, if it has a meaning, what does it mean? Perhaps it's like زرت and زپرت and doesn't really mean anything outside its particular idiom?
     
  8. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Well, unfortunately your meaning is not clear to me in this question. Can you explain it much more, please?

    It is pronounced as Teleng. تلنگ means "fart", albeit in a joking way! تلنگ is common in colloquial completely and this couplet is very famous when we want point to a person jokingly when he have fart:


    خوش اومدي؛ مُشَرَّف!
    كي بود تلنگش در رفت؟



    When we use تلنگ كسي در رفتن idiomatically as my previous example that you mentioned to it, that mean "the only reminded unit of his/her breath (= life) was as equal as a fart and when he farted, the only reminded part went away too and he died completely!".
     
  9. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Oh! the missed part:
    So when we want to say "a person is so weak" we will use:

    به باد/گوز بند بودن

    For example:


    زنش به باد/گوز بنده! تا پخ كني مريض مي‌شه و بايد بره بيمارستان
    همين غذاها رو مي‌خوري كه به باد/گوز بندي!
    حالا خوبه به باد/گوز بنده و اگه دماغشو بگيري جون از كونش در مي‌ره، اينقدر پرروئه! اگه زور داشت ديگه چيكار مي‌كرد؟!!
    فكر كردي منم مثل تو به باد/گوز بندم كه با دوقدم پياده روي تلنگم در بره و ولوشم؟


     
  10. Aryamp

    Aryamp Persimod

    Tehran
    Persian
    Hi

    Treaty's translation is the most natural equivalent for feeling tired. Other variations could be:

    زنش ناگهان احساس بی‌حالی کرد برای همین به خانه بردش
    زنش یک دفعه احساس بی رمقی کرد در نتیجه بردش خانه

    بی حالی and بی رقمی describe a feeling of fatigue/exhaustion/lack of energy




    These are all actually quite rude and derogatory (albeit to different digrees) I wouldn't suggest using them unless one intentionally wants to sound rude.

    Again one must be very careful when using this idiomatic expression since it's rather impolite/offensive. Another natural equivalent for 'feeling weak /fatigued' is : احساس ضعف کردن so the original sentence could be also expressed in this way:

    زنش ناگهان احساس ضعف کرد

     
  11. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Many thanks to you both - I must apologize, but I don't have time to give a full response right now as I'm busy with New Year stuff. But let me give Morteza the clarification
    he asked for:
    what you say is borne out here = what you say is proved/demonstrated by this: http://www.forvo.com/word/زرتش_قمصور_شده/
    what meanings would you assign to زرت and زپرت? = what meanings would you give زرت and زپرت? = what do زرت and زپرت mean in your opinion?
     
  12. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Thanks to the clarification.

    According with dictionaries, زرت and فزرت are the same and mean رمق، توانايي. According with this meaning, زرتش/فزرتش قمصور شد is correct, but you will not heard it from any body at the present. I don't know I should call it a common mistake or a new generation phrase, but at the present all the people are using it as زپرتش قمصور شد.

    Also I can not remember any sentence with زرت too! All of the sentences that I can remember are using زرتي or زرت و پرت/زورت.
     
  13. marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    ^ janaab-e-searcher SaaHib, saal-e-nau mubaarak bar shomaa. And I think seitt wanted colloquialisms and got them, and as we know in all languages colloqialisms tend to border on the polite/impolite distinction but you have to know how and when to use them. Also, searcher marked the expressions as 'impolite'' by way of a warning.
     
  14. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Thank you all so much – at last I have the chance to have a proper look at everything. If I may take the liberty of summing up, it would seem that زرت = رمق= (last) spark of life/energy, an interesting concept.

    What is the polite Colloquial Persian equivalent of this, please? Perhaps you simply put رمق in the place of تلنگ?

    In English, “He gave up the ghost” is the exact equivalent but is polite and even quite formal. The Colloquial English equivalent is perhaps, “He croaked.”

    Is زورت pronounced 'zevert'?

    Is this پخ pekh (boo/peekaboo) – or pokh?

    Is ولوشم from وِلو شدن (spread/sprawl/scatter/disperse)? Perhaps “fall apart, fall to pieces” is the best translation here?

    PS Remember it's always “thank you / thanks FOR” something (not “to” – this is for the person you're thanking): “Many thanks (to you/Fred/John) for the clarification.”

    PPS It's “according TO” or “in accordance WITH”.
     
  15. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    Thanks for it. An intensive suggestion.

    Well, the only polite colloquial equivalent that I can remember at the present is نا. In other words, از نا رفتن is the colloquial equivalent of تلنگ كسي در رفتن. Also از پا افتادن (= to be collapsed) is used in colloquial so much too. We may hear از پا در آمدن in conversation too, but: 1) it is a stronger form of از پا افتادنi 2) it is fairly formal).

    Some examples:


    زنش از نا رفت، بردش خونه
    زنش از پا افتاد، بردش خونه
    من كه ديگه نا ندارم راه بيام
    من كه ديگه از پا افتادم، نمي‌تونم راه بيام



    No, it isn't. It is pronounced as Zoort. In other words, Zert-o-Zoort or Zert-o-Pert are correct.

    Yes, it is Pekh (= a sudden sound created by a person for fearing other people)

    Yes, it is ولو شدن. I think "to be spread" and "to be sprawl" are the best. ولو شدن here is not "spreading to separate pieces". It is something such as a ball of bread dough (خمير نان) when you drop it of a distance to a surface. This pic is a good example of ولو شدن. We will call it وا رفتن too.

    Thanks a million because of the notifications.
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014
  16. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Thank you so much, truly most useful and fascinating too.
    Please could you give some examples with زرت و پرت and زرت و زورت?
    Two things:
    1. In به باد/گوز بنده, is it the idea that she is dependent on باد (breath rather than wind?) or گوز (fart) in the sense that if one of these things escapes from her she will die?
    2. In تا پخ كني, is تا equivalent to اگه?
     
  17. puya New Member

    Farsi
    The familar (and polite) way to say this if Farsi is:
    زنش ناگهان از حال رفت. پس بردش خونه
    More formal:
    زنش ناگهان از حال رفت. پس او را به خانه برد

    p.s. برای همین = for this reason = so
    پس in farsi can be used as 'so' (reasoning) or 'then' (succession).
     
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2014
  18. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    اينقدر زرت و پرت ﴿زيادي﴾ نكن! حرف دهنتو بفهم ﴾= Don't say small talk! Think about your words before saying them)
    فقط زرت و زورت ﴿زيادي﴾ مي‌كنه، موقع عمل كه بشه هيچي توي چنته نداره ﴾=he is just estimating himself/herself greater than he actually is by words, but when it is the time of act, he will be nothing!)
    اگه يه بار ديگه زرت و پرت ﴿زيادي﴾ كني، چاك دهنتو جر مي‌دم!
    اينقدر زرت و زورت ﴿زيادي﴾ نكن! بتمرگ سر جات





    Both of them could be correct! Other synonyms for به باد/گوز بند بودن is به فوت/چس بند بودن. In my mind that mean "he is so weak that if you shoot him/her with a فوت/چس/گوز/باد, he will die!".

    آگه is not meaningless here, but I prefer to translate it as "as soon as" (=به محض) or "immediately after"
     
  19. WannaBFluent

    WannaBFluent Senior Member

    French (فرنسي)
    سلام
    ل طفا, I don't uderstand, all these sentences exactly mean the same than the English one? Or did you change some words to make it more colloquial and impolite?
    خیلی ممنون دوست من
     
  20. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Just to say many thanks to Searcher 123, very helpful indeed.

    By the way, I get the impression from much written here that in Iran, life is identified more with the breath and less with light – for example, English has the idiom “a spark of life”, but so much here seems connected with the breath. But do you agree that this is the case in Iran?
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2014
  21. Treaty Senior Member

    Australia
    Persian
    از حال رفتن actually means "to faint". We can use بی حال شدن instead to connote loss of livelihood (though it still differs from "feeling tired").
     
  22. WannaBFluent

    WannaBFluent Senior Member

    French (فرنسي)
    I didn't even know that. It's very strange (to me) to compare light with life. In France, life is also identified with the breath (la respiration).
     
  23. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    The overall meanings are the same, however, surely I changed some words to make it more colloquial and impolite. Surely it is not a wort to word translation.

    I think I'm agree! Albeit in some sentences you can find a combination of "light" and "life", but the meaning of these sentences are different "living". For instance بارقۀ زندگي ﴾= a spark of life﴿ in Persian mean "something that will function as an effort's engine in people's life", say, hope.

    اميد، بارقه‌اي است در زندگي كه نبودش، زندگي ﴿= پويايي و تلاش روزمره‌ي بشر﴾ را خواهد ميراند
     
  24. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    Many thanks, most useful.
    My first encounter with the causative verb میراندن/میرانیدن (to cause to die):)!
     
  25. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    You are welcome as always.
    Well, it is not so strange! because ميراندن/ميرانيدن is not used in daily conversations. It is used more in literary sentences. Its colloquial equivalent is كشتن.
     
  26. seitt Senior Member

    Turkey
    English/Welsh
    A good insight - many thanks.
     
  27. WannaBFluent

    WannaBFluent Senior Member

    French (فرنسي)
    Thank you for the precision!
     

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