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possessive + genitive

Discussion in 'Türkçe (Turkish)' started by Arabus, Sep 27, 2013.

  1. Arabus Senior Member

    United States
    Arabic-Aleppo
    Hello,

    When we add the genitive suffix -(n)in to nouns ending with possessive suffixes it seems that the result differs according to the possessive suffix.

    For example:

    benim odam + -(n)in = benim odamın (the genitive suffix -ın was agglutinated to the possessive -m)
    futbol takımı + -(n)in = futbol takımının (the genitive suffix -nın was agglutinated to the possessive -ı)

    However:

    bizim takımımız + -(n)in = bizim takımın (instead of agglutinating the genitive suffix -ın replaced the possessive -ımız)


    So what is the rule? Is it that plural possessive suffixes are removed when the genitive suffix is added?
     
  2. murattug Senior Member

    Turkish
    quick and short answer is: no.

    (Evimizin kapısı açık =bizim evin kapısı açık) <> evin kapısı açık
     
  3. Almula New Member

    Turkish
    There is no rule like that, actually this is grammatically incorrect as we have been told at school. Sometimes we don't add the first suffix and quickly use the other one. But it's also okay to use it that way

    for example; Bizim eve gelebilirsin - benim kitapta bu yazmıyor - sizin takım da bayağı iyiymiş

    thay are same as these sentences = Evimize gelebilirsin - kitabımda bu yazmıyor - takımınız da bayağı iyiymiş

    I think it's about stressing the word.
     
  4. Arabus Senior Member

    United States
    Arabic-Aleppo
    Thanks. So what I understand is that since the possessive is marked on the pronoun (benim, sizin, bizim, etc.) it is possible to omit the possessive marking from the possessed noun, and this will not change the meaning.

    Bizim evin kapısı açık = evimizin kapısı açık

    In both these sentences the possessive marking is apparent (either on bizim or evimizin), so the intended meaning is clear.

    However, in the sentence evin kapısı açık the possessive marking is not apparent, so the meaning is defective.

    I wonder if this sentence is correct:

    Bizim evimizin kapısı açık

    This sentence has double possessive marking, which is supposedly the norm in Turkish, but the two friends who answered did not mention such a sentence (which has possessive marking both on the pronoun and the noun).
     
  5. Almula New Member

    Turkish
    But you can't always use that form. It depens on what you are talking about. I guess that can be used in general things. The more you speak this language better you will learn to use it.
     

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