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  1. undertheweather Junior Member

    English, US
    relents de souffre

    This refers to women who seem to be subjected to violence in advertisements.

    Would a translation be whiffs/hints/suggestions/insinuations/traces of suffering?

    Merci en avance
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2010
  2. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Are you sure it's not "relents de soufre" (one "f") (eg whifs of sulphur)? If not I imagine it's a pun based on that - very difficult to translate so before I tax my brain I'll wait for you to confirm!:D
     
  3. Lezert

    Lezert Senior Member

    Midi-Pyrénées
    french, France
    pourquoi pas simplement
    "les violences faites aux femmes dans la publicité"?
     
  4. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    He's translating from French, I believe.
     
  5. Lezert

    Lezert Senior Member

    Midi-Pyrénées
    french, France
    des relents de soufre ( with one "f" ) , c'est quelque chose de diabolique ( les apparitions du diables sont censées s'accompagner d'une odeur de soufre). Par extension, quelque chose qui a des odeurs de soufre, c'est quelque chose qui va aller chercher dans les plus mauvais cotés de l'homme , dans les zones noires.
     
  6. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Then we need to find something (preferably) that is a bit of a pun in English too - since I'm sure that the French is making a joke out of the phrase "relents de soufre" by rewriting it as "souffre". Thinking cap on...
     
  7. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    But I don't think it's subtle at all - I think that on hearing the phrase "relents de sou(f)fre" (so you can't hear the number of "f"s) you would think "whiffs of sulphur" and so by writing double "f" the author is making a pun. If you think about it, "whiffs of suffer" (without a joke being involved) doesn't make much sense.
     
  8. Gardefeu Senior Member

    x
    x
    Excusez-moi, mais ce n'est pas encore très clair, à mon avis... il y a vraiment 2 F à souffre dans le texte original?
     
  9. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Oui, je crois.
     
  10. OlivierG

    OlivierG Senior Member

    Toulouse, France
    France / Français
    Peut-être est-ce simplement une coquille (typo) ? :D
     
  11. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Mais, cela ne vous semble-t-il pas à vous francophones une assez bonne blague que d'écrire "relents de souffre" dans un article sur la souffrance ?
     
  12. Gardefeu Senior Member

    x
    x
    C'est pour ça que je pose la question... pas la peine de se casser la tête à trouver un jeu de mots équivalent en anglais s'il s'agit tout simplement de relents de soufre...

    PS (après avoir découvert le message simultané de timpeac): Mon intuition me dit que c'est tout simplement soufre...
     
  13. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Et pour ça que j'ai demandé des précisions à undertheweather aussi. Elle a répondu

    The whiffs of sulfur made me giggle but in the context there is a distinct manque of sulfur
     
  14. Gardefeu Senior Member

    x
    x
    Euh... et ça veut dire quoi?
     
  15. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Qu'à son opinion ce n'est pas une erreur.:)
     
  16. OlivierG

    OlivierG Senior Member

    Toulouse, France
    France / Français
    The explanation has been provided by Lezert in post #6 ;)
     
  17. LV4-26

    LV4-26 Senior Member

    If it meant hints of suffering, it would be relents (?) de souffrance, not relents de souffre. As it is, relents de souffre doesn't make any sense. Relents de soufre (with a single 'f'), on the other hand, does make sense....in isolation. Yet, I agree it isn't very meaningful in your context.

    So there we are.

    I agree with Tim that (since you're definite there is no typo) it must be a pun. It could be funny if it didn't miss its target (for the reason I alluded to in the beginning : souffre isn't a noun in French, it's a conjugated verb).
    Conversely, it can be funnier if the "leading" sense is meant to be "whiffs of sulphur"
     
  18. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    But let's not forget that when you have to translate something you have to over-analyse it to the nth degree and so not-great puns can seem terrible. If you just came across that sentence in an article about suffering in a magazine would you not just note it as a small, not particularly wonderful, pun and move quickly on without thinking about it further?
     
  19. Gardefeu Senior Member

    x
    x
    An extraordinarily common mis-spelling, to say the least!
    Several dozens of pages on Google... ;)
     
  20. LV4-26

    LV4-26 Senior Member

    Yes. My last post wasn't very clear. What I meant was
    If the main sense is supposed to be hints of suffering, the pun is awkward.
    It the reader's main interpretation is to be whiffs of sulphur, then it's a good pun.
    Which is why I think whiffs of sulphur (i.e. the smell of the devil) is the primary meaning. And the double 'f' is there just to hint at the verb souffrir.

    I'm also aware that makes it all the hardest to translate. :(
     
  21. Cath.S.

    Cath.S. Senior Member

    Bretagne, France
    français de France
    What do you all think of it reeks of fire and brimstone ?
     
  22. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Oh just go away, breezing in here with your brilliant suggestions with nary a by-your-leave!:D
     
  23. Cath.S.

    Cath.S. Senior Member

    Bretagne, France
    français de France
    Ok, I'm off. :mad: :D
     
  24. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    Et en complément à la jolie prose de Lezert :) cette définition du Petit Robert 1 (vieille édition 1991)

    Loc. fig. Sentir le soufre (un f): se dit d'écrits ou de propos peu orthodoxes, dont la liberté paraît "diabolique"

    :eek: :eek: I just noticed there was a page #2 to this long thread !!
     
  25. geve

    geve Senior Member

    France, Paris
    France, French
    Sorry, I wasn't invited either, and I don't have a brilliant suggestion or even a bad one, but I must say, I don't think that it's a good pun (if there is a pun at all)... because of Gardefeu's post #26: it's a common spelling mistake. I'm not sure many would spot that there's an additional F. I must confess, I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't spot anything wrong in the spelling of souffre, and would just read "relents de soufre". :eek:
     
  26. timpeac

    timpeac Senior Member

    England
    English (England)
    Yes - I find that post of Gardefeu's quite convincing as well.:)
     
  27. Cath.S.

    Cath.S. Senior Member

    Bretagne, France
    français de France
    Souffrez que je mette mon grain de soufre :

    je ne crois pas non plus à l'hypothèse du jeu de mots voulu, mais j'avance en revanche celle de la faute d'orthographe inconsciemment influencée par le contexte.
     
  28. geve

    geve Senior Member

    France, Paris
    France, French
    Misspelling "mispelling" - now that would be a good pun :D
     
  29. ChiMike Senior Member

    Chicago USA
    USA, English
    qui ne date pas de hier:
    Nicot, Thresor de la langue française (1606)

    souffre (Page 604)
    Souffre, Cerchez Soulfre.
    soulfre (Page 605)
    Soulfre, Sulphur.
    Lumiere de la couleur de soulfre, Lux sulphurea.
     

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