1. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    BONJOUR, je traduis un menu
    je n'arrive pas à traduire Salade Terre et Mer Salade, saumon fumé, moules, toast au chèvre, crevettes) / (salad, smoked salmon, mussels, shrimps, goat’s cheese toasts)


    Je ne sais pas s'il existe un nom un peu gastronomique pour ce plat en anglais
    j'ai essayé
    Salad from earth and sea mais ça fait lourd je trouve.

    merci d'avance
     
  2. moustic Senior Member

    near Limoges
    British English
    A land and sea salad ??

    PS in the ingredients, "salade" would probably be "lettuce".
     
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2013
  3. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    Thank you! lettuce is better but i'm not sure if it's really lettuce so i will ask ;)
     
  4. Enquiring Mind

    Enquiring Mind Senior Member

    UK/Česká republika
    English - the Queen's
    I think I would keep salade terre et mer. Restaurant menu translations I come across out here in Cz and elsewhere in Europe are a never-ending source of mirth, and usually no use whatsoever in helping the hapless diner decide what to choose.
     
  5. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    land and sea salad sounds less poetic but if all my menu is written in english, salade terre et mer will appear strange,no ?
     
  6. Enquiring Mind

    Enquiring Mind Senior Member

    UK/Česká republika
    English - the Queen's
    Well, menu translation is more of an art than a science, and very hit-and-miss. People who go to restaurants offering the kind of menu you are translating are usually sophisticated and urbane enough to understand basic French and recognize the classic dishes. The rest get a burger from a greasy spoon cafe.

    Land and sea invasion? I like it. Land and sea salad? D'oh!
     
  7. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    ok thanks you're right :)
     
  8. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    I wouldn't know about Europe, but in Canada, we often see "terre et mer" translated as "surf and turf" in menus.

    However the "turf" part usually refers to meat.
     
  9. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    Ah ah this appellation is funny, it keeps the rhyme :) !

    but i wonder if it sounds less gastronomic than the french "terre et mer" ?
     
  10. Nina1922 New Member

    Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
    Mandarin Chinese
    In China, we just translate it as: Salad "Terre et Mer", then write what's included (smoked salmon, mussels, toast...)and will not confuse the guests, right? Sometimes there just isn't a similar English expression that could poetically match with the French one.
     
  11. bazalpin Senior Member

    Jersey City, NJ
    French - France
    Je crois que ce que Moustic veut dire c'est que lettuce est le terme générique pour "salade verte". En tous cas dans les restaurants ici aux USA, quand je lis lettuce, je ne m'attends pas forcément à de la laitue.
    Après rien ne t'empêche de donner le nom exacte de la variété utilisée.
     
  12. playflorette New Member

    FRANCAIS
    ah bon, merci pour cette précision intéressante, je ne savais pas :)
    je prends note
     
  13. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    Je ne sais pas ce que Moustic voulait dire, mais si j'entends lettuce je comprends bel et bien laitue (il y en a diverses sortes, romaine, frisée, boston, iceberg...)
    Pour moi une salade verte est un mélange de verdures/légumes.
     
  14. bazalpin Senior Member

    Jersey City, NJ
    French - France
    OK, je clarifie.
    En France, quand salade est un ingrédient, c'est un générique pour laitue (de différente sorte) ou chicorée (comme la scarole par exemple). J'ai rarement vu laitue ou chicorée utilisé dans un descriptif de plat, c'est généralement salade ou alors carrément la variété utilisée. De même quand on dit qu'on va acheter une salade au marché ou au supermarché ça peut être une romaine, feuille de chêne, scarole etc.
    Par expérience, il me semble qu'en anglais, lettuce est utilisé de la même façon que salade (le végétal, pas le plat) en français. Et c'est pour ça que, selon moi, Moustic avait conseillé d'utiliser lettuce à la place de salad dans la liste des ingrédients parce que salad en anglais est un plat et pas un végétal. Désolé si j'ai extrapolé.

    Je regrette l'utilisation de "salade verte" qui a prêté à confusion, j'aurais dû dire: "salade (le végétal)" pour être plus clair.
    La "salade verte" est en effet un plat (pas forcément un mélange d'ailleurs).
     
  15. CarlosRapido

    CarlosRapido Senior Member

    Québec - Canada
    français - English (Can)
    Pour en revenir à la question originale, Salade terre et mer peut être traduit par Surf and Turf Salad.
     
  16. Language Hound Senior Member

    American English
    The problem with Surf and Turf Salad, for me at least, is that "Surf and Turf" is already an established term used to describe a main course, not a salad, which includes meat (turf) and seafood (surf). If I saw the term used to describe a salad, I would expect the salad to contain meat, and the OP's salad does not.
    See here for more info on "Surf & Turf."
     
  17. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    J'ai déjà suggéré "surf and turf" (#8) pour « terre et mer », mais je ne trouve pas le "turf" (qui est en général du bœuf) dans la liste d'ingrédients du post #1.:D

    Edit : je n'avais pas lu le post de Language Hound.

    @ bazalpin : J'ai pensé que c'est ce que tu voulais dire. C'est juste que perso, je ne dis pas « salade » si je veux dire « laitue ou autre végétal feuillu qui se mange en salade ». Pour moi la salade est toujours un mets/plat ou un mélange.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2013
  18. CarlosRapido

    CarlosRapido Senior Member

    Québec - Canada
    français - English (Can)
    So what? Tacos are a Mexican main course but we can still have a Taco salad, they are not mutually exclusive. The same should go for Surf 'n Turf, the phrase meaning, of the sea and earth. And, why should we restrict this to lobster and steak? The recipe in post #1 includes elements of both origins.
     
  19. Language Hound Senior Member

    American English
    My suggestions would be to either keep "Salade Terre et Mer" and follow it by the list of ingredients, i.e., Salade Terre et Mer (lettuce, smoked salmon, mussels, shrimp, goat cheese toasts)* or, since really the only ingredients not from the sea are the lettuce and the goat cheese toasts, to call it a Seafood Salad with Goat Cheese Toasts and also follow it by a list of the ingredients. Or, if you want to jazz it up or make it sound special, you could call it a Supreme Seafood Salad with Goat Cheese Toasts.

    *As mentioned above, "lettuce" is the generic term for "salade" and includes all varieties of lettuce, not just "laitue."
    "Shrimp" without the "s" is what you normally see on American menus even when there are several shrimp in the dish; "shrimps," though also accepted as the plural form of shrimp seems very strange (and even incorrect, though I know it's not) to my American eyes and ears.
    Even though "chèvre" is "goat's cheese," here you're using it as an adjective, so you would say "goat cheese toasts." Note that many restaurants in the U.S. also just call it "chèvre" so you could say "chèvre toasts" as well.
     
  20. wildan1

    wildan1 Moderando ma non troppo

    The problem is that English-speakers know this term to mean seafood and meat -- I would not want to run a restaurant using that term and have clients upset because the "turf" wasn't anything but a little piece of goat cheese on toast...
     
  21. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    Thanks. I stand corrected. I thought for sure that lettuce meant laitue. :eek: I learned something new.
     
  22. Language Hound Senior Member

    American English
    I share your opinion. After all, in a discussion about food from the land and the sea, certainly there should be more than just steak or meat representing the land! Unfortunately, however, we're talking about a term, Surf and Turf, which was coined over half a century ago and is well established in the U.S. restaurant industry's lexicon with its meaning of "seafood and meat." Note that it originally just referred to the pairing of lobster and steak and has expanded to include other surf and turf items, but there still must always be seafood and meat per the established definition of this term.

    If I were to see a "Surf and Turf Salad" with seafood but no meat on a menu that I knew had been translated into English, I would think that the translator was clueless. And the restaurant would most likely lose credibility--and customers!--due to its "false advertising."
     
  23. Zoë Rose Senior Member

    English-Australia
    The following can be seen on Google recipe sites.

    The Florette Sea and Earth Salad recipe, created by Raymond Blanc in the heart of Le Manoir Aux Quat' Saisons kitchen, has been designed to inspire people to experiment with exciting salad recipes and ingredients and put this delicious food in the spotlight!

    By Signé-Déco 11/18/12
    Une salade entre terre et mer Le plus long était de décortiquer le tourteau, mais franchement ça vaut le coup. Ingrédients pour 2 personnes 1 tourteau 1/2 céleri-rave 1 petit bol de mayonnaise recette ICI 10 cl de crème liquide allégée 4 crevettes pour. La dEeco, 1 citron vert
     
  24. wildan1

    wildan1 Moderando ma non troppo

    I like Sea and Earth Salad--no false advertising there.

    Sometimes yes and sometimes no, and it also might depend on what continent one is--see this thread.
     
  25. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    Thanks Wildan,

    I don't think it depends on the continent. I'm not saying that nobody in Quebec uses salade as a generic term in French.
    All I'm saying is that I personally don't.

    I use salade to mean... salad. If I mean laitue or any other leafy vegetable, then I usually name the vegetable. ;)

    Other than "Sea and Earth Salad" I'd like to suggest : "Land and Sea Salad".
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2013
  26. moustic Senior Member

    near Limoges
    British English
    And that brings us back to post #2! :)
     
  27. Nicomon

    Nicomon Senior Member

    Montréal
    Français, Québec ♀
    Oops, sorry about that moustic. :eek: I think I focused on the lettuce part of your post and missed it.

    I should have written that I have a preference for Land and Sea Salad rather than Sea and Earth Salad.
     

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