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Se agregan y cancelan timbres de ley.

Discussion in 'Legal Terminology' started by california, Sep 27, 2005.

  1. california New Member

    USA English
    Hi! I am looking for the translation of this notarial phrase in Costa Rica. thanks!
     
  2. begoña fernandez Senior Member

    Madrid
    Spain - Spanish
    Hi California,

    can you explain what is a "timbre de ley". literally it means Law or Legal Stamps. Agregar is add and cancelar = cancel. So it would be Legal stamps are added and cancelled". In Spain the sentence would be considered as something legal without much sense outside this field.
    Hope you can use the sentence.

    regards

    BF
     
  3. letts New Member

    English and Spanish, Canada
    In Colombia, the word "cancelar" has an alternate meaning. It can mean "paid in full." I suspect that the same is true in Costa Rica. I would translate this as "Legal stamps added and paid in full," or "Legal stamps attached and paid in full," or "Legal stamps included and paid in full." (depending on the nature of the stamps).
     
  4. legalchick New Member

    Guatemala, español
    En Guatemala, al hablar de "cancelar" un timbre o sello fiscal, se refiere a la forma de invalidar dicho timbre, con el proósito que el mismo no vuelva a ser reusado al ser desprendido del documento en el cual se hace pago del impuesto y colocado en otro diferente. Las formas de cancelar el timbre serían colocar el sello del Notario directamente sobre el timbre o bien, haciendo una pequeña perforación en el mismo.
     
  5. letts New Member

    English and Spanish, Canada
    Yes, this would have been my initial interpretation. In most of the Spanish-speaking world, "cancelar" does indeed have a similar meaning to its English equivalent. However, I had a visa for Colombia once and they use the term 'cancelado' to mean 'paid' (in legalese). This has even entered their vernacular, as people will say "hay que cancelarlo" in notary offices. What they mean is that you have to go to the next desk to pay for it and get the stamp/seal. So, "cancelar" has a bizarre and illogical secondary meaning there that is something to the effect of "pay for it so that it is validated." While learning Spanish, I found this very confusing, because I thought they were asking me to cancel it. In Spanish dictionaries, it says it means "cancel," but, believe me, this is not always the case. In London, I encountered consular officials (including a native Spanish speaker) who asked me why my newly-processed Colombian visa had been cancelled! It was perfectly valid! Someone in Colombia (and perhaps Costa Rica) has to put an end to this to stop all the transboundary confusion.
     
  6. letts New Member

    English and Spanish, Canada
    Reading your reply more closely, your response seems to clarify the meaning and demonstrate that it actually isn't a contradictory term at all. If I understand you correctly, the term "cancelar" really means to declare that the document is not transferable and is only valid in its current state. In effect, the notary makes the document official in the presence of the document holder, and "cancels" (terminates) the opportunity to alter the document or transfer it into another document for use for any other purpose. Is that about right? In this sense, it could actually mean "cancel," even though it is putting the document *into* effect. Is this more or less accurate?
     
  7. the boss Senior Member

    Mexico
    Mexico
    Antiguamente, en México, los impuestos o derechos que generaba una actuación se pagaban a través de timbres: se compraba el importe correspondiente al impuesto o derecho en timbres y con eso se acreditaba el pago.

    en el caso de los notarios, los impuestos (no sus honorarios) causados por un determinado acto, también se pagaban con timbres. El notario los pegaba en el testimonio correspondiente y luego los cancelaba con su firma o rúbrica para evitar un posterior uso.

    Sin embargo, debía de anotar la sacremental frase de "se agregan y cancelan timbres de ley" para que el tesimonio pudiese surtir todos sus efectos legales.

    Actualmente ya no es así. Los impuestos o derecho se pagan en la oficina Recadudadora (llamada Tesorería) y se agrega al protocolo y testimonio el recibo correspondiente.

    Saludos
     
  8. letts New Member

    English and Spanish, Canada
    Boss: Por fin, tenemos una respuesta interesante que tiene sentido! Gracias!
     
  9. mariachiz

    mariachiz Senior Member

    Tegucigalpa
    English/Spanish, Honduras
    cancelar en el sentido legal lo entiendo yo como pagar y por ende poner fin a la deuda, cancelarla. does that make sense? asimismo se usa en facturas, al estar ya pagadas.
     
  10. David Senior Member

    To simplify: these are "revenue stamps," similar to postage stamps, still used in many countries, and quite often in Costa Rica, as a means of collecting fees. They exist in the United States as well, though more and more the "stamps" are not gummy little squares of paper, but the imprint of a metering machine. By giving a public official stamps worth a certain amount, and requiring that they be accounted for, the government seeks to control the handling of cash, just as the post office collects revenue by "selling stamps," really little receipts for payment of the charge for delivering a letter or parcel.

    In any event, the phrase means "the revenue stamps required by law having been affixed and canceled..." (canceled, just as the post office cancels postage stamps so they cannot be reused. It could mean the "revenue stamps required by law having been affixed and paid for," but I don´t think that is the intention of the use of "cancelados." In Costa Rica, as in many other countries, many documents require that revenue stamps be affixed. Sometimes the process of converting a worthless piece of paper covered withg writing into a valid legal document by affixing the necessary revenue stamps is called "habilitar el documento." Another form of timbre fiscal was "papel sellado", sheets of paper with a fancy government seal at the top, sold at X amount per sheet, and required for contracts, applications for government services, deeds, etc. Still in use in many places. Nowadays, plain paper can be "habilitado" by taking a typewritten contract to this or that Ministerio, paying the fee of X Glubglubs per sheet, and having the pages "habilitados" with a postage meter. Sometimes--viva la herencia burocrática española--you buy "papel sellado," but the price has gone up, so you have to use papel sellado and timbres fiscales to cover the price increase.

    I hope this clears it up.
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2008
  11. mariachiz

    mariachiz Senior Member

    Tegucigalpa
    English/Spanish, Honduras
    Yes, indeed, gracias mil, David. I've lived the reality but never before thought it through!
     
  12. figgyfish

    figgyfish Senior Member

    West coast of US
    English US
    Quite late, but I was given a Costa Rican document to translate and the stamps are indeed cancelled just as a post office would cancel them.
    and I love David's humor re: paying glubglubs-- :D
     

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