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ser/estar libre - los elefantes son/están libres

Discussion in 'Spanish-English Grammar / Gramática Español-Inglés' started by LaGringa83, Feb 22, 2013.

  1. LaGringa83 Senior Member

    USA
    United States English
    Hola

    I am wondering if I should use ser libres or estar libres in this sentence.

    " Los elefantes en el zoo no son/están libres. "

    Gracias por la ayuda
     
  2. Sleptikal

    Sleptikal Junior Member

    Chilean - Spanish
    Both of them are correct.
     
  3. steemic

    steemic Senior Member

    Pitman, New Jersey
    English (US)
    While you can use either one, I would use son because elephants generally are not at a zoo for a short period of time.

    You are referring to a lack of freedom in the long term.
     
  4. RicardoElAbogado Senior Member

    SF Bay Area, California
    American English
    As Sekptikal indicated, with a lack of context, it's hard to be sure of which one to use.

    Having said that, I would use estar because you are describing their condition, which typically uses estar. You use estar with muerto even though the person will be dead for a long, long time!
     
  5. mlruirod New Member

    España
    Español
    As the others users say, it's hard to be sure even for native speakers.

    I would use "los elefantes en el zoologico no se encuentran/están en libertad"
     
  6. loudspeaker Senior Member

    Madrid
    British English
    Ah, context, how important it is!

    Por ejemplo, yo diría...

    No me gustan los zoológicos porque los animales no están en libertad. (no diría ni 'están libres' ni 'son libres')
     
  7. Caninone

    Caninone Junior Member

    Madrid, Spain
    Español, España
    Para rizar el rizo voy a poner un ejemplo aunque sea obvio:

    Los animales en el zoo no son libres porque no están en libertad.
     
  8. geostan

    geostan Senior Member

    English Canada
    My own thought is this:

    If you are comparing zoo elephants with the ones in the wild, then no son libres would appear to me to be the way to go.
    If on the other hand you are considering the elephants as caged or imprisoned, you might use no están libres. This could also imply that under some circumstances they might be returned to the wild.
     
  9. Adolfo Afogutu

    Adolfo Afogutu Senior Member

    Uruguay
    Español
    En el futuro alguien se preguntará cómo este hilo es tan largo. Asumo mi parte de culpa :rolleyes:. Yo también prefiero el "no están en libertad", o "están en cautiverio". Aunque claro que decir que los animales del zoo están en cautiverio o que no están en libertad no deja de ser una obviedad. Pobres animales, no visito ningún zoo ni parque acuático donde haya animales en cautiverio.
    Saludos
     
  10. Magmod Senior Member

    England
    England English
    Para evitar la controversia entre estar y ser, es posible decir:
    Los elefantes en el zoo no (son/están) quedan libres.
     
  11. loudspeaker Senior Member

    Madrid
    British English
    En mi modesto entender, y con todos los respetos, le digo que no está bien.
     
  12. Julvenzor

    Julvenzor Senior Member

    Sevilla
    Español propio (Andalucía, España)

    No, como sugiere loudspeaker, con el verbo "quedar" no es posible. En cambio, sí sería correcto utilizando los verbos "hallarse" o "encontrarse":

    Los elefantes del zoo no se hallan/encuentran libres.

    El verbo "quedar" implica cambio de estado.

    Un saludo.
     
  13. Magmod Senior Member

    England
    England English
    Sometimes one can substitute quedar and many other verbs for estar or ser:
    Dónde queda el edificio? = Where is the bldg?
    ...mientras su colega quedó herido = ... while his colleague was injured > you avoid estar or ser problem
     
  14. Magmod Senior Member

    England
    England English
    Claro, porque no hay contexto, mi sugerencia es algo posible para evitar la controversia

     
  15. loudspeaker Senior Member

    Madrid
    British English

    You've made a very good point there. Yes, sometimes, "quedar" can be translated as a form of "to be," but when it could be replaced by "to lie" as in...


    La recesión ha quedado atrás. (The recession is behind us.)
    El pueblo más cerca queda a 5 km, 10 minutos en coche. (The closest town is five kilometers away, 10 minutes by car.)
    Se pudo observar que miles de peces quedaron muertos en la orilla, como consecuencia de los contaminantes. (It was observed that thousands of fishes were dead on the shore as a result of the pollution.)
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2013
  16. Magmod Senior Member

    England
    England English
    Thanks Loudspeaker for your reply. I learn a lot from you.
    I like this example because Ricardo said "You use estar with muerto even though the person will be dead for a long, long time!”
    Your example resolved this problem of having to remember to use estar + muerto.
    I think > quedar muertos sounds better.
     

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