substitute for - passive voice

Discussion in 'English Only' started by Effi#, May 6, 2014.

  1. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Hello everyone!


    I am confused about how can I use correctly the passive voice of the word "substitute for"!

    Firstly, I would like to ask if the following sentence is correct to ensure that I have completely understand the meaning of the word "substitute for":

    - In the second half of our century, computers will substitute for text books!
    (I want to say that text books will be replaced with the computers). So, is my above sentence correct?

    Secondly, I am very confused about the passive voice of the "substitute for":

    - Text books will be substituted for computers in the second half of our century!
    (I want to say that text books will be replaced with computers). So, did I write correct the above sentence, by using the passive voice of the "substitute for"?
    Or I give the completely opposite meaning of what I want to give?


    Thank you


     
  2. sound shift Senior Member

    Derby (central England)
    English - England
    Hello,

    "Substitute for" sounds a little strange here. I would use "replace":
    Active voice: "Computers will replace text books."
    Passive voice: "Text books will be replaced by computers."
     
  3. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Is it easy to tell me what is the difference between "replace" and "substitute"?
    Could you please give me some examples by using the words "substitute for" and the passive voice "substituted for"?
     
  4. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Is there anyone who can help me? :confused:
     
  5. Keith Bradford

    Keith Bradford Senior Member

    Brittany, NW France
    English (Midlands UK)
    A substitute is a temporary replacement, or a second-best. It doesn'ty mean a permanent replacement or a long-term one.
     
  6. duvija

    duvija Senior Member

    Chicago
    Spanish - Uruguay
    I'm sure it's the same problems we, Spanish speakers, have with those verbs. However you use them, it'll sound counter-intuitive. I've ditched 'substitute' from my English vocabulary, and stick to 'replace', as sound shift said. It's really confusing otherwise.
     
  7. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Could you please give me an example sentence of the passive voice of the "substituted for"?
     
  8. Terry was substituted for Lampard in the 70th minute.
     
  9. duvija

    duvija Senior Member

    Chicago
    Spanish - Uruguay
    Great. Now, a little detail: who was playing and who took his place? Seriously, I wouldn't know which way it goes.
     
  10. Myridon

    Myridon Senior Member

    Texas
    English - US
    Active sentence 1: I substituted Terry for Lampard. I took Lampard out and put Terry in.
    Active sentence 2: Terry substituted for Lampard. Lampard is out, Terry is in. Terry wanted to do this or they agreed on it or something.

    Passive version of 1: Terry was substituted for Lampard.
    Passive version of 2: There is none because it's intransitive.
     
  11. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Thank you a lot!!!! :):):)
     
  12. Effi# New Member

    GREEK
    Passive version of 1: Terry was subsituted for Lampard.
    It means that, I took Lampard out and put Terry in?
     
  13. Gabriel Malheiros Senior Member

    Portuguese - Brazil
    Look this sentence I found on the ESPN website :
    Thiago suffered an injury and was substituted for Cazorla...

    Following the logic above, shouldn't it be "Thiago suffered an injury and Cazorla was substituted for him"?
     
  14. PaulQ

    PaulQ Senior Member

    UK
    English - England
    "Thiago suffered an injury and was substituted for Cazorla [by the manager]. This sounds as if the injured Thiago took the place of Carzola.

    "Carzola substituted for (= on behalf of) the injured Thiago." :tick:

    To substitute is an ergative verb that is optionally transitive.These verbs work in this way:

    To drink is unergative and optionally transitive:

    1. I drink <- intransitive. It cannot take the reflexive pseudo-object "myself"
    2. I drink beer. <- transitive.

    If I say 1. you know I will drink something, so the intransitive form of the verb does not act on me -> it acts on an assumed object. This is how unergative, optionally transitive verbs work.

    To substitute is ergative and optionally transitive

    1. I substitute for John <- in its intransitive form, substitute (obviously) does not take an object, although it can take the reflexive pseudo-object "myself".
    Substitute is modified by a prepositional phrase.
    The verb acts on the subject as it has no assumed object.
    Intransitive verbs cannot appear in the passive.

    2. I substitute the real diamond [with a fake]. <- transitive. The verb acts on the object -> the object is substituted with a fake. <- and you will see that this is the passive form.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2016
  15. Gabriel Malheiros Senior Member

    Portuguese - Brazil
    and the sentence I suggested? --> Thiago suffered an injury and Cazorla was substituted for him"?
    is that ok?
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2016
  16. PaulQ

    PaulQ Senior Member

    UK
    English - England
    It is OK.
     

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