Urdu-Hindi-Persian: decision

Discussion in 'Indo-Iranian Languages' started by marrish, Feb 10, 2013.

  1. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    Hi,

    For 'a decision' we have several words in Urdu, one of them being فیصلہ. I am used to this pronunciation: faislah. A friend of mine suggested that the word is in fact faisalah.

    Which one is correct? Which one you are used to hear/speak?

    Just in order to expand this topic, what is the difference between فیصلہ and تہیہ?

    What can be 'a ruling' (a court's decision)?
     
  2. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    I'm sorry I forgot to add Hindi and Persian in the thread title. Persian and Hindi input is very welcome!
     
  3. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    For Persian, I think I have come across the word تصمیم tasmiim which I don´t think has been ever used in Urdu.
     
  4. Faylasoof Senior Member

    Plato's Republic
    English (UK) & Urdu (Luckhnow), Hindi
    The original is indeed faiSalah but most say faiSlah (faislaa).

    BTW, تصمیم taSmiim and مصمم muSamam are both used in higher Urdu vocabulary. Both derived from the Arabic verb صَمّ Samma and used for / and in relation to decisions.
     
  5. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I think "tahiiyah karnaa" is a much firmer decision, but not as firm as "Thaan_naa".
     
  6. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    ^ Thank you for bringing the verb unto the discussion.

    I heard one person of Hariyaanvii background pronounce fais(a)lah '' pheNslaa ''
     
  7. searcher123

    searcher123 Senior Member

    My home ;-) /The Persian Gulf
    Farsi/Persian/فارسي
    In modern Persian فيصله دادن (Feysaleh Daadan) is used just in the meaning of "to dispose" (i.e. دعوا يا اختلافي را حل و فصل كردن). But فيصله alone as a noun is not used at all (at least I have not heard it to now).
     
  8. tonyspeed Senior Member

    JA- English & Creole
    The Hindi spelling leaves the option open for saying faisalaa by not using a conjunct in the middle, but in practice I have only ever heard
    faislaa.

    I beleive in English THaannaa is best translated as "to resolve".
     
  9. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    The Urdu spelling "fyslh" provides many more options!:)

    H ٿهاننا ठाननाṭhānnā (fr. ṭhān, q.v.), v.t. To fix or settle (in the mind), to resolve, determine on; to be intent on, set the heart upon; to perform.
     
  10. Alfaaz Senior Member

    English
    فیصلہ کرنا seems to be like "to decide", تہیہ کرنا like "to prepare (for an action)", while عزم کرنا or ٹھاننا seem closer to "to become resolute"
     
  11. greatbear Senior Member

    India
    India - Hindi & English
    There's certainly a little bit of schwa, not whole though, for me in "fais-laa" (the same little bit of schwa as in "maul-vii"). In both cases, I do not consider it as a complete schwa, hence I write both as "faislaa" and "maulvii".
     
  12. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I agree with you (and with tonyspeed SaaHib). There is some overlap in meanings and in some contexts one meaning may be more dominant than another.

    yih dunyaa aaxir faanii hai
    aur jaan bhii ik din jaanii hai
    phir tujh ko kyoN Hauraanii hai?
    kar Daal jo dil meN Thaanii hai!

    uTh baaNdh kamar! kyaa Dartaa hai?
    dekh Xudaa kyaa kartaa hai!

    Nazeer Akbarabadii (1735-1830)
     
  13. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    [Urdu] Do you consider تجویز tajwiiz an appropriate word besides faisalah?
     
  14. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    (gavaahoN ke bayaanaat ko madd-i-nazar rakhte hu'e) ek jaj apnaa faisalah sunaataa hai. agar tajviiz pesh kare gaa to log use radd bhii kar sakte haiN!
     
  15. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    You've convinced me not to use it through this example.
     
  16. urdustan Junior Member

    Urdu & English
    Greetings,

    Which is considered more "proper" usage? faiSalah karnaa yaa faiSalah lenaa?

    I think it's faiSalah karnaa but I've been hearing faiSalah lenaa more and more in recent times.

    There's also faisalah denaa which I've heard in legal contexts. Example: jaj (judge) ne faiSalah diyaa
     
  17. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    I would risk a statement that faiSalah karnaa is proper and in a legal context, it would be jaj ne faiSalah Saadir kiyaa.

    I am curious whether you would be able to provide some example sentences to illustrate the usage of ''faisalah lenaa'' in order to discuss this issue further.
     
  18. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I've heard "faisalah sunaayaa" not "faisalah diyaa".
     
  19. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    I can join you with my experience. This is the basics of Urdu for this situation and then we get Saadir and jaarii kiyaa. I am hopeful you would agree with me that there is faiSalah farmaayaa in the said context.
     
  20. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    iraadah in Urdu and qasad in Persian.
     
  21. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    I am afraid I can't find any relation of this post with the topic at hand? Or am I missing something? And is the word not 'qasd'?
     
  22. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Yes, it should be "qasd". I might have misunderstood your intent. I thought you wanted words for "decision". You suggested "tasmiim" for Persian. I've come up with "iraadah" for Urdu and "qasd" for Persian. The latter actually means "intent" but in the right context it seems to mean "decision" too.
     
  23. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    Do you mean 'iraadah' as in (musammam) iraadah baaNdh lenaa? Because otherwise I'd understand both qasd and iraadah to mean 'intent' in the first place.
     
  24. gagun Senior Member

    TS,india
    Telugu-TS, Deccani-TS
    can there be a difference between faislah and faislaa?
     
  25. marrish

    marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    How do you mean? In which way?
     
  26. Faylasoof Senior Member

    Plato's Republic
    English (UK) & Urdu (Luckhnow), Hindi
    The only difference is in the spelling, hence reflected in the transliteration. But there is a bit more to it.

    As per transliteration conventions many of us are following, it would be faiSlah (فیصلہ) in Urdu and faislaa (फ़ैसला) when written in Hindi. Other than that there is no difference, certainly not the way we use it.
     
  27. gagun Senior Member

    TS,india
    Telugu-TS, Deccani-TS
    I mean to say فیصلا and فیصلہ
     
  28. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I suppose the difference would be same as if you decided to write deecision for decision. The former is not acceptable in English, the latter is the norm. فیصلہ is the correct word, فیصلا is n't.
     
  29. gagun Senior Member

    TS,india
    Telugu-TS, Deccani-TS
    thank you for your reply
     

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