Urdu: I need to talk to you

Discussion in 'Indo-Iranian Languages' started by ihsaan, Jan 22, 2013.

  1. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Hi,

    If I want to say, "I need to talk to you", would it be correct to write:

    Mujhe aap se baat (f.) karni hai.


    The reason I´m wondering is that if I wanted to say: "I have to sleep.", I think I would have to write the verb in infinitive ("Mujhe sona hai."), however, it seems that if there are any words in between, the verb gets either an a/i (depending on the word in between). Is this correct?

    For example: Mujhe khana (m.) khana hai.
     
  2. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    The "karnii" form is usually associated with the "Delhi School of Urdu" whilst "karnaa" is linked to the "Lucknow School". You will find that there is an overlap in this and this could be due to personal choice of the poet to suit his purpose.

    "mujhe baat karnii hai"

    This, as I have indicated above is the Delhi style. In addition, Hindi speakers would use this format as well as Punjabi speakers. This usage is identical to the way this is expressed in Punjabi. (maiN gall karnii e)

    So, if one were to follow this usage, one would say..

    mujhe khaanaa khaanaa hai

    mujhe ghar jaanaa hai

    mujhe kaam DhuuNDnaa hai

    .....

    mujhe roTii khaanii hai

    mujhe baat karnii hai

    mujhe laRaa'ii laRnii hai

    ................

    In the second set of examples with feminine nouns, the Lucknow school users would say "khaanaa hai, karnaa hai, laRnaa hai"

    So, your sentence could be..

    mujhe aap se baat karnii hai

    mujhe aap se baat karnaa hai

    Take your pick!

    Examples from poetry..

    baat karnii mujhe mushkil kabhii aisii to nah thii
    jaisii ab hai terii maHfil kabhii aisii to nah thii

    Bahadur Shah Zafar

    xvaab meN vuh aane kaa kyoN kare ab va3dah
    ya3nii kab judaa'ii meN mujhe niiNd aanii hai

    Naasix Faizabadi
    (Lucknow School)

    (Apologies, I could n't think of anything to illustrate the Lucknow usage in poetry)

    Please note:

    maiN xat-likhnaa chaahtaa/chaahtii huuN

    maiN chiTThii likhnaa chaahtaa/chaahtii huuN

    xat is masculine and chiTThii is feminine.

    And your sentence would now be..

    maiN aap se baat-karnaa chaahtaa/chaahtii huuN.
     
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2013
  3. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    What an excellent and thorough answer. This clarifies a lot! Thank you. I think I'll go with the Lucknow school:)
     
  4. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    You are most welcome! As to your choice, Faylasoof SaaHib would be most pleased!:)

    By the way, you could also say...as in a song..

    mujhe kuchh kahnaa hai
     
  5. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Hehe:).

    By the way: could I use guftaguu karnaa the same way? (I.e. with the same meaning) Or would that sound strange?
     
  6. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    Not strange. Formal certainly! It is more "conversation" than "talk" but once again context would be important.
     
  7. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Ok, then it's probably best to avoid using it in normal conversation.
     
  8. mastermind1212 New Member

    India-Hindi
    YES this is correct.
     
  9. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Does anyone know how the prevalence of the "Delhi School of Urdu" and "Lucknow School" way of speaking relates to the regional differences in Pakistan?

    It seems that in regions like Punjaab, for example in Lahore, one would say "mujhe namaz paRhni hai", but what about places like Karachi and Islamabad?
     
  10. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    It really depends on the speaker's background and not whether it is Lahore, Islamabad or Karachi. Lucknow background speakers (and those following their speech pattern) would tend to say...

    mujhe namaaz paRhnaa hai.

    Delhi background/influenced speakers would say..

    mujhe namaaz paRhnii hai.

    There are several threads devoted to the "-ii/-aa" variation.
     
  11. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Yes, I understood that from your previous excellent explanation, but I guess what I was trying to ask is which of the two is most commonly used in those areas of Pakistan. I´m sure one must be more commonly used than the other? I will look into the other threads as well and see if they might go into further detail. Thank you for mentioning that. What picked my curiosity again, was that a person from Lahore corrected me today due to me speaking according to the Lucknow school, saying that "nobody says/talks like that" (referring specifically to the usage of karna versus karni in situations where the object of the sentence was a feminine word).
     
  12. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
    I can't provide you any accurate statistics but I would suggest that in the Punjab "karnii" form is likely to be the dominant style in terms of numbers. In Karachi, you will no doubt find whole areas using "karnii" and others using "karnaa.

    I would n't worry about the person who has "corrected you". If you feel comfortable using the "karnaa" form, stick to it. He/she is wrong when he/she tells you that "no body speaks like that". There are millions of people who would speak like this!
     
  13. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Ah, how interesting! Thank you for your uplifting reply.
     
  14. Qureshpor Senior Member

    Punjabi, Urdu پنجابی، اردو
  15. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Much obliged!
     
  16. Alfaaz Senior Member

    English
  17. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    How kind of you, thank you. (I think it would be a good idea to have a sticky thread with a main post sorting links pertaining to the same/similar questions, under specific topics. This would make finding information about certain grammatical points easier.)
     
  18. Faylasoof Senior Member

    Plato's Republic
    English (UK) & Urdu (Luckhnow), Hindi
    This is correct too: Mujhe aap se baat karnaa hai.
     
  19. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    Yes, that is how I would usually say it; My initial post was written due to being confused by people insisting that it was (karni). Not to prolong that discussion any further, but I again spoke to someone from Lahoor today who had never heard of the Lucknow version of saying this (karna) at all. I spoke to two others today from Karachi who insisted that "karni" was what was generally used there as well. It seems that perhaps the usage of "karni" might be more prevalent in most areas of Pakistan...
     
  20. Faylasoof Senior Member

    Plato's Republic
    English (UK) & Urdu (Luckhnow), Hindi
    janaab-e-waalaa, all these people who are saying this are blissfully unaware of the flexibility of our language. Best not to get into what would be nothing but a waste of time. Besides, I've heard and seen (in print: books / newspapers etc.) both versions coming out of Pakistan! Both have a long and established history in Urdu.
     
  21. ihsaan Senior Member

    Norwegian
    No doubt, and I was not trying to dispute that, Faylasoof SaaHib. I was merely pointing out that the usage of one seems to be more prevalent than the other in Pakistan (in colloquial speech, not books/newspapers), but my guess is only just that...a guess. Thanks to this forum, at least I now know that both versions can safely and correctly be used. :thumbsup:
     
  22. marrish Senior Member

    اُردو Urdu
    Full agreement from my side. If someone is interested one can listen to 'Urdu Poetry Readings of Jaun Elia!' around 1:11 where he says:

    لیکن ہاں مجھے ایک بات کہنا ہے۔ lekin haaN mujhe ek baat kahnaa hai۔۔
     

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