αιτιατική - accusative case

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chiprespanol

New Member
Turkish
Hi everyone,

I have recently started taking Greek classes but I am mostly working on my own. Recently I have started studying on accusative case. But I need some clearence on the issue of articles. I know that before the letters κ,ξ,π,τ,ψ the articles ο and η become τον and την. But what about το?

Can someone clarify this issue please. Are there any other place where they become τον/την or στον/στην. And does το ever take v, is it always το/στο without v?

Eυχαριστώ πολύ!
 
  • artion

    Senior Member
    Greek
    Are you asking about the neutral article το, or about the masculine το(ν)?

    Τhe neutral is always το in accusative. The masculine is τον before vowels and most consonents (B, K, M, possibly Λ, Σ, Τ, Φ, Χ, Ψ). But this rule is not very strict. TON tends to be preserved in old-fashioned writen and spoken language. In demotike (especially the spoken) many people may drop the N before any consonent, but always keep N before vowels. The same apply with THN.

    A simple rule for beginners, if you are at loss: Always use τον for masculine nouns and adjectives, την for feminine and το for neutral.
    This will save you in the case of adjectives, when the causative of masculine and neutral are the same and a "το" may cause a masc. to be mistaken as neutral.
     
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    Δημήτρης

    Senior Member
    Cypriot Greek
    "A "ν" more is better than a "ν" less" Καλύτερα ένα ν περισσότερο παρά ένα λιγότερο.

    I personally do follow artion's beginners' rule: Since I find the "before p-t-k-b-d-g" rule quite arbitrary (in Greece, ν is always dropped in speech, in Cyprus it's always pronounced), I preserve the ν in the masculine and the feminine articles τον-την, the indefinite article έναν and the words μην and σαν.
     

    orthophron

    Senior Member
    Greek
    Hi!
    I'm surprised Greek natives. We don't drop ν of masculin and feminine article before κ, ξ, π, τ, ψ and if it ever occurred in wriring it would be a typo.
     

    Δημήτρης

    Senior Member
    Cypriot Greek
    orthophron, it does happen in the spoken language. For example I remember listening to several university professors on a Skai's documentary and they all pronounced "το πολεμο", without a "ν". Probably they do write it down because they adhere to the prescribed rule, but it shows that in the spoken language the -n is dropped so often that we could call it the norm.
    Using Google search, one can see that in masculine nouns the tradition is stronger, with most results preserving the silent ν but the feminine article has it's final ν dropped half of the time.

    It all boils down to what I quoted to my first post here: Καλύτερα ένα ν περισσότερο παρά ένα λιγότερο.
    ---
    chiprespanol, you'll soon realize that Greek spelling is not as straightforward as Turkish, where you only have few exceptions to the norm (like yumuşak ge) :)
     

    chiprespanol

    New Member
    Turkish
    Thanks everyone for the explanations!
    ---
    Δημήτρης I did not know you spoke Turkish :) I am from Cyprus too. I thought as a Cypriot, I should speak both languages of my country!
     
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    orthophron

    Senior Member
    Greek
    orthophron, it does happen in the spoken language. For example I remember listening to several university professors on a Skai's documentary and they all pronounced "το πολεμο", without a "ν". Probably they do write it down because they adhere to the prescribed rule, but it shows that in the spoken language the -n is dropped so often that we could call it the norm.
    Using Google search, one can see that in masculine nouns the tradition is stronger, with most results preserving the silent ν but the feminine article has it's final ν dropped half of the time.
    Well I 've had the chance to watch part of the TV documentary, but I must say I didn't notice it so far. All that happens is the usual assimilation of final ν before κ, π, τ : ν+κ is pronounced as /ng/ or /g/, ν+π as /mb/ or /b/ and ν+τ as /nd/ or /d/.
     
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