というのも何だった

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thetazuo

Senior Member
Chinese - China
確か卵と牛乳が切れていたはずだったし、このまま帰ってしまうというのも何だった。

Context: the speaker went to school as usual only to find the school building had already collapsed. So he decided to go shopping before going home.

Hi. What does the underlined part mean? And can we omit the という here? Is the という still 伝聞 in this example?
Thank you.
 
  • MKwhale

    Member
    Japanese
    Hello,
    if the usage of 何だった here sounds unnatural to you, thetazuo-san, I agree with you.
    Anyway the sentence is made to mean, "Once I cared to leave home, I should do something useful for me to avoid returning home just in vain."

    Let me show you an example 何だった is used naturally.

    「何だったら先に帰ってもいいよ」
    This is said by a person to a friend who looks to have something to care about.
    The reason may:
    --- have something to do,
    --- not enjoying the movie.
    But any reason the speaker would accept without arguing about it.
    Therefore, 「何だったら」 can be an abbreviated description of 「何か事情があるのだったら」

    Next, an example 何だ is applied to the speaker him/herself, as in the case of your thread.

    「このまま帰るのも何だからお茶でも飲もうか」
    In this case the speaker would say, "I feel a bit awkward if we get back immediately."
    But the speaker feels awkward even to describe what he/she feels in concrete words; he/she expects the partner to guess the reason and agree with him/her.

    In both examples above, the speaker expects his/her counterpart to fill what is meant by 何.
    But in your thread case, who fills the what? Reader? 馬鹿馬鹿しい。私ならご免蒙る。

    Your second question
    という is not always 伝聞. Please look at

    期待できない組織との前提

    , where I explained about という.
    In your thread case, という can be omitted because it is already followed by の.

    That's all.
     
    Last edited:

    thetazuo

    Senior Member
    Chinese - China
    Thank you, MKwhale-san. So the という in question is just used to introduce a content clause, like “that...”, right?

    By the way, I have read this example.
    だが、士道には再度問いを発することができなかった。アナウンスによって気勢をそがれたというのもある
    The bold part means “part of the reason is.../partially because...”, right? If I’m on the right track, I think the という in the bold part can’t be omitted since it indicates reason. Does it make sense?
     

    MKwhale

    Member
    Japanese
    という in question is just used to introduce a content clause, like “that...”
    Yes, introduce and pass the content over to the sentence thereafter.
    This is the essential function of the word という; and when it is applied to what another person says, the function confined is called 伝聞.

    アナウンスによって気勢をそがれたというのもある
    The bold part means “part of the reason is.../partially because...”, right?
    Yes, you are right.

    I think the という in the bold part can’t be omitted since it indicates reason.
    Good question.

    But the sentence omitting という, namely
    気勢をそがれたのもある
    still works better than the one omitting の, namely
    気勢をそがれたというもある
    which is broken.

    理由 is held not by という but by の.
    You can confirm this by replacing them by 理由 respectively.

    気勢をそがれたという理由もある
    works, while
    気勢をそがれた理由のもある
    is broken.

    cheers.
     

    thetazuo

    Senior Member
    Chinese - China
    Hi, MKwhale-san. Can I ask about two more similar sample sentences here?
    1. 彼女が空を飛べるというのはわかっているのだが……
    2. 『んー、ま、四糸乃の敵に塩を送るってのは本意じゃないけどぉ?…』

    1a. 彼女が空を飛べるのはわかっているのだが……
    2a. 『んー、ま、四糸乃の敵に塩を送るのは本意じゃないけどぉ?…』

    I think 1 and 1a are the same, and comparably, 2 and 2a are the same because the という doesn’t have any nuance but is just used in the same way as in the examples in op and post #3 (introduce a content clause). Am I on the right track?

    I also think if what precedes というのは is a clause, then というのは and のは are the same.

    But if what precedes というのは is a noun, then というのは and は are different.
    For example,
    3. 甘やかされて育った若者 {は/というのは} 挫折しやすい。
    4. 「それで......もう一つの理由ってのは何なんですか?」
    It seems the というs in 3 and 4 have a concrete meaning “you say”.
    Am I on the right track? If not, please correct me.

    Thank you.
     
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