你刚起床(了)吗?

Discussion in '中文+方言 (Chinese)' started by yuechu, Oct 5, 2016.

  1. yuechu Senior Member

    Canada
    Canada, English
    大家好!

    A 网友 recently told me that "你刚起床吗?" is better than “你刚起床了吗"? But it happened in the past. Do you know why 你刚起床吗 is better than 你刚起床了吗?
    Someone (on a different website) told me that: "我们可以说“你刚吃饭了吗”“你刚洗澡了吗”都是问你刚才有没有吃饭 洗澡 但是“你刚起床了吗”感觉很奇怪 而且跟“你刚起床吗”意思点不一样.

    Does anyone know why this is? I admit that I often don't know when to use the word 了 in Chinese!
    Thanks!
     
  2. Skatinginbc

    Skatinginbc Senior Member

    Canada
    Mandarin 國語
    你剛出生嗎? *你剛出生了嗎?
    出生 come out of a mother's body and start to exist
    出生是動作(come out)瞬間轉狀態(into existence, into life)

    起床 rise from bed after sleeping, get out of bed
    起床是動作(rise)瞬間轉狀態(out of bed)
    你剛起床嗎?==> 問動作, 清楚你現在的狀態(being out of bed), 但不確定你是何時做的動作, 起的床
    你起床了嗎?==> 問狀態, 不清楚你現在是 out of bed, 還是 still in bed.
    *你剛起床了嗎? ==> 邏輯混亂了, 不知你是問動作, 還是問狀態
     
  3. SuperXW

    SuperXW Senior Member

    刚 and 了 are quite complicate. I'll try to explain them in this way.

    刚吃饭吗?
    =你刚刚吃饭吗?
    刚 stresses "JUST".
    刚 is short for 刚刚

    Rhetorical question: Were you JUST eating? Why so late?

    刚吃饭了吗?
    =你刚才吃饭了吗?
    了 stresses a finished status, so 刚 DOES NOT stresses "just".
    刚 is short for 刚才
    Direct question: HAVE you EATEN OR NOT just now?

    Let's use 起床 to replace 吃饭.

    刚起床吗?
    =你刚刚起床吗?
    刚 stresses "JUST".
    刚 is short for 刚刚

    Rhetorical question: Were you JUST getting up? Why so late?

    刚起床了吗?:warning:
    =你刚才起床了吗?
    了 stresses a finished status, so 刚 DOES NOT stresses "just".
    刚 is short for 刚才

    Direct question: HAVE you GOT UP OR NOT just now? :confused:
    But the answer is obvious: the listener must have get up so he can listen to the question. The question itself is unnatural.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
  4. fyl Senior Member

    Mandarin Chinese
    SuperXW has made a wonderful point that the two 刚's are completely different. To add a few more points of my personal understanding:

    1. For the first 刚 (in 你刚起床吗), my feeling is that "才" vs "刚才" is a better explanation than "刚刚" vs "刚才" (since 刚刚 also has the meaning of 刚才).
    你刚起床吗=你才起床吗=你是刚起床吗=你是才起床吗 (起床 can be replaced with other verbs)=You didn't get up until now?=Are you right now in the state of "just get up"?

    One possible context: You look so sleepy has haven't dressed up. Did you just get up? (你刚起床吗)
    The question focuses on what is right now. And it cannot be replaced from 你刚才起床了吗, which focuses on what happened just now.


    2. I don't agree with all others that 你刚起床了吗 is wrong. One can create a context so that it sounds correct: You said you would get up this morning at 7:00am. I called you at 7:05am, but no one answered the phone. Then I called again at 7:10am. I'm curious if you got up as you had said: Have you gotten up just now? (你刚起床了吗)

    In this context, the question can be replaced with 你刚起床吗, but the meaning will be different. 你刚起床了吗 is just a simple question asking whether the action has happened or state has been entered at the moment of "just now", whereas 你刚起床吗 is asking about "right now". If I asked 你刚起床吗, that implies I'm assuming that you didn't answer phone because you didn't get up (not that you already got up but didn't hear it) and also involves some kind of blame.

    Here 刚=刚才=just now=a moment ago. And you can move it to the front: 刚你起床了吗? 刚才你起床了吗? (In the first case where 了 is absent, you cannot move 刚 or 才.)
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2016
  5. lingkky Senior Member

    chinese
    刚 means just and 刚才means just now.and 了 means already.
    “你刚起床了吗?”is totally wrong. As it can be translated as "Have you just woke up already?" "Just "and "already" can't be put together in the sentence.


    It should be"你刚起床吗?”or “你起床了吗?” which mean“Have you just woke up" and "Have you woke up already?"(for status or condition )


    For here "刚才”means just now.
    "你刚才起床了吗?” is the way to ask for the status in the past ."Were you woke up just now?"
    Or "刚你起床了吗?”also works by putting 刚 before the sentence if you want to remove 才which means" just now"
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  6. fyl Senior Member

    Mandarin Chinese
    I understand some may think 你刚起床了吗 as wrong, because the usage of 刚=刚才 could be regional. I can sense the colloquiality.

    However, I don't quite understand why one think 你刚才起床了吗 is wrong. This has exactly the same structure as 你六点的时候起床了吗, where you can replace the time 六点的时候 with any other time, including 刚才.
    Maybe you have misunderstood it. 你刚才起床了吗 is asking if you were wake up just now. The fact that person is awake right now does not imply that he was awake a moment ago. 你刚才起床了吗 is not asking 你现在起床了吗.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  7. lingkky Senior Member

    chinese
    You are right .I edited already.

    你刚才起床了吗? is true .I have explained it in my post.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 7, 2016
  8. Skatinginbc

    Skatinginbc Senior Member

    Canada
    Mandarin 國語
    That would be 你刚刚(才)起床吗 for me.
    你刚才起床了吗 = 刚才(的那时候)你起床了吗 (e.g., 他刚才進來的那时候, 你起床了吗)

    你刚才起床了吗 = 刚才你起床了吗 , whereas 你刚刚起床吗 ≠ *刚刚你起床吗

    *你刚起床了吗*, *刚你起床了吗*
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  9. yuechu Senior Member

    Canada
    Canada, English
    Thank you all for your replies! I will definitely have some studying to do!
    谢谢大家的帮忙!
     
  10. fyl Senior Member

    Mandarin Chinese
    This is exactly what I meant. Sorry for that mistaken English sentence in my previous post. "asking if you were wake up just now" is supposed to be "asking if you were awake just now" (still not very accurate. How would you translate this? Is 'Had you gotten up a moment ago?' a right sentence?).
    See other parts (before and after) parts of #6.
    你刚刚(才)起床吗 is another valid sentence that has a different (but similar) meaning.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2016
  11. Skatinginbc

    Skatinginbc Senior Member

    Canada
    Mandarin 國語
    A: 你叫他叫了個老半天,他到底起床了沒?
    B: 他剛(= 剛剛)起床了。

    A: 他究竟死了沒?
    B: 他剛(= 剛剛)死掉了,好不容易。

    可是:*他剛起床了嗎,*他剛死掉了嗎 ==> 不順耳
    原因:不清楚問話者到底是對「剛」,還是對「了」有疑問。也就是問得不清不楚,莫明其妙。
     
  12. fyl Senior Member

    Mandarin Chinese
    To me 他刚起床了吗=他刚才起床了吗=他刚刚起床了吗≈≈几分钟以前,他起床了吗。 是对“了”有疑问。如果是对“刚”有疑问,应该问:他刚起床吗 (where I believe the 刚 is different).
     
  13. lingkky Senior Member

    chinese
    刚和了应该不能同用。
     

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