巧克力、壓克力的克唸一聲 (but 馬賽克的賽唸四聲)

[KLAUSED]

我以為很多人把巧克力和壓克力的克唸成一聲是因為兩個四聲(克、力)連在一起唸起來有點吃力。雖然中文詞彙裡面有不少四聲+四聲的例子，畢竟一聲+四聲唸起來比較輕鬆而且巧克力和壓克力是外來語不需要拘泥聲調。

但我今天發現馬賽克的賽幾乎沒有人會唸一聲，都唸四聲!!

我想知道為什麼很多人把巧克力和壓克力的克唸成kē。
還有如果大家習慣唸kē，怎麼不用其他字(科、棵、顆等等)代替?

 

[Ida1]

雖然中文詞彙裡面有不少四聲+四聲的例子，畢竟一聲+四聲唸起來比較輕鬆而且巧克力和壓克力是外來語不需要拘泥聲調。

音译过来的外来词，我个人认为最大的原则是去贴近原来的读音，除了顺口以外，估计还考虑了重音的位置等。
比如：
巧克力，重音在巧，克变为了轻声；
马赛克，重音在赛，所以读四声比较合适；
压克力/亚克力，这个词重音也在克，我个人也是读四声。

 

[Ben 536]

我想會不會是周邊人的讀音差異呢？

因為像“亞克力”這樣的詞彙，我一般不是看見就知道讀“kè”，我是學習別人的讀音，聽久了，自然而然的讀成了“亞kè力”。

而我想你說的讀音區別，會不會是你身邊人一開始讀‘亞kē力’，讀多了，身邊人自然變成了“亞kē力”。

相似的例子比如“豆豉”，有不同的讀音比如豆丝、豆石、豆食、豆是。還有“风”，有讀“fong”也有“feng”。

 

[KLAUSED]

而我想你說的讀音區別，會不會是你身邊人一開始讀‘亞kē力’，讀多了，身邊人自然變成了“亞kē力”。

我是有用yougilish查詢裡面有講到壓克力的youtube影片。念kē的居多(約8成)。因為壓克力是台灣的講法，所以我查到的都是台灣人做的影片。

至於巧克力，有一支CCTV的影片叫做
[启航2021]魔术《巧克力幻想曲》 表演：简纶廷| CCTV
可以聽到主持人也是念巧kē力(@2:17~)。表演人是台灣人他也念巧kē力。

相似的例子比如“豆豉”，有不同的讀音比如豆丝、豆石、豆食、豆是。

"豉"字似乎只會出現在"豆豉"裡面，跟相當常用的"克"不一樣，我覺得應該要另當別論。

 

[SimonTsai]

念 kē 的居多 (約 8 成)。[...] 我查到的都是台灣人做的影片。

Taiwanese here. Yes, it is true that many of us pronounce it ke1 and not ke4. However, as you've noticed, some of us do pronounce it ke4, i.e., 壓克4力4.

I suspect that 壓1克1力 is an example of phonetic lag assimilation, but I am not an expert. So take my words with a grain of salt. Maybe some linguistic professionals will explain.

 

[KLAUSED]

Taiwanese here. Yes, it is true that many of us pronounce it ke1 and not ke4. However, as you've noticed, some of us do pronounce it ke4, i.e., 壓克4力4.

Do you also pronounce 巧克力 as 巧kè力?

 

[SimonTsai]

Do you also pronounce 巧克力 as 巧kè力?

No. I usually pronounce 巧克1力.

压克力/亚克力，这个词重音也在克，我个人也是读四声。

For your information, when pronounced 壓1克1力, the stress usually falls on 力.

 

[KLAUSED]

No. I usually pronounce 巧克1力.

So for you it's 壓kè力 but 巧kē力? Interesting how kè becomes kē in 巧克力 but not in 壓克力 which one would think is more prone to undergo phonetic assimilation since 壓 is first tone.

 

[all-time newbie]

巧克力和压克力的克严格说不是一声，我认为是轻声（neutral tone）

如果查字典，它们的标准读音都是四声。但在口语中，一些非重读或强调的音会变成轻声。比如休息一下的“一”（二声）。和朋友聊天随口说时就可以读轻声。但如果想要强调，也可以读二声。都听起来很自然。

如果你想把巧克力的克读四声，也没有问题。我是经常听到的。如果你想把亚克力的克读轻声，也没有问题，我也听到很多人这样读过。

 

[KLAUSED]

因為我熟悉的是台灣華語，我不太清楚把巧克力、壓克力的克讀成輕聲時整個詞的發音變成怎麼樣。

我知道輕聲的調值因前面的聲調而所有不同(如圖)。所以把亚克力的克讀輕聲的時候是唸亚(5-1)克(1)力(5-1)嗎?感覺唸起來有點吃力😅

 

[all-time newbie]

因為我熟悉的是台灣華語，我不太清楚把巧克力、壓克力的克讀成輕聲時整個詞的發音變成怎麼樣。

我知道輕聲的調值因前面的聲調而所有不同(如圖)。所以把亚克力的克讀輕聲的時候是唸亚(5-1)克(1)力(5-1)嗎?感覺唸起來有點吃力😅
View attachment 85149

Imagine the way you would read “ch”in the word “technology”

By the way, my reply is based on my experience as a native mandarin speaker, and I am fully aware that there is quite a difference between Taiwanese mandarin and Chinese mainland mandarin. But the way I see it, how a word is read is heavily influenced by the way people first heard it when it was first introduced into a language, the way it is pronounced in commercial ads or TV shows and also how the original word sounds in the original language. For instance, when we say 奥特曼（ultra man ) in mandarin, people often put stress on 奥 and read 特 in the neural tone unless you want to read it real slowly and put stress on each syllable because it is the way we first and often heard it pronounced and also closer to the way it sounds in the original language.

 

[Ida1]

我知道輕聲的調值因前面的聲調而所有不同(如圖)。所以把亚克力的克讀輕聲的時候是唸亚(5-1)克(1)力(5-1)嗎?感覺唸起來有點吃力

Actually, some people might pronounce 亚yǎ克ke力lì.

 

[KLAUSED]

there is quite a difference between Taiwanese mandarin and Chinese mainland mandarin.

The difference is such that most Taiwanese would not use the neutral tone to pronounce 克 in the middle of the words like 巧克力 and 壓克力 as @SimonTsai's comments #5 an #7 suggest.

Actually, some people might pronounce 亚yǎ克ke力lì.

Yes, I've noticed that when I was checking out YouTube clips with that word in them. 亞 is also yǎ in Taiwan so it might be an old pronunciation.

 

[kategogogo]

Actually, some people might pronounce 亚yǎ克ke力lì.

That is how I always pronounce it. The trick is the speed. If spoken quickly enough, the tones blend together, and it can be perceived more like 亚yǎ克ke力lì. But when spoken deliberatly, a clearer individual tones ya2 ke4 li1 is more likely be pronounced.

If 亚克力 is pronounced strictly following the rules in dictionary, all three characters would be in 4th tone. Pronouncing 3 consecutive 4th tones feels extremely uncomfortable and make it really challenging to speak quickly in real-time conversation. Thus native speakers adjust accordingly and choose the tones which feel the most effortless and smooth. Tones are not meant to be rigid rules set in stone. Rather they should contribute to the fluidity and naturalness of speech. While Mandarin learners are taught specific tone patterns, it's more important to bear in mind that the goal of learning the tones is effective communication, some flexibility can be acceptable.

 

[KLAUSED]

Pronouncing 3 consecutive 4th tones feels extremely uncomfortable and make it really challenging to speak quickly in real-time conversation. Thus native speakers adjust accordingly and choose the tones which feel the most effortless and smooth.

That's what I thought was happening with two 4th tones such as 巧kē力 too. Pronouncing kēlì is less strenuous than kèlì. But then people have no trouble saying 身分證 or 要去看電視 without altering the tones at least in Taiwan and the only logical explanation I can come up with is that 巧克力 is a loanword and people tend to feel more liberal about altering the tones.

 

[wuliyuan]

我以為很多人把巧克力和壓克力的克唸成一聲是因為兩個四聲(克、力)連在一起唸起來有點吃力。雖然中文詞彙裡面有不少四聲+四聲的例子，畢竟一聲+四聲唸起來比較輕鬆而且巧克力和壓克力是外來語不需要拘泥聲調。

但我今天發現馬賽克的賽幾乎沒有人會唸一聲，都唸四聲!!

我想知道為什麼很多人把巧克力和壓克力的克唸成kē。
還有如果大家習慣唸kē，怎麼不用其他字(科、棵、顆等等)代替?

“克”这个字不是多音字，它的发音就是念第四声，而且巧克力和亚克力的正确读音都是念第四声，但是念第一声也能明白是什么意思

 

[Aramuk]

We don't have a problem here in Malaysia. We just call it "chocolate".

 

[KLAUSED]

“克”这个字不是多音字，它的发音就是念第四声，而且巧克力和亚克力的正确读音都是念第四声，但是念第一声也能明白是什么意思

我來台灣沒多久的時候聽到同學說巧kē力我問他克明明是四聲怎麼把它讀成一聲他就說唸四聲講起來怪怪的。後來也沒遇過唸四聲的。所以我想至少在台灣應該可以把巧克力改寫成巧科力之類，讓它說寫一致😂

 

[SimonTsai]

所以我想至少在台灣應該可以把巧克力改寫成巧科力之類，讓它說寫一致

前後文足的話，看得懂，但就看不慣。就像我們不會寫「誵小孩 (小小孩)」或「鼠叔嚎 (叔叔好)」。