沒明白<了>

[yuechu]

大家好！

I was writing the following sentence in the thread "说明白":
其实我可能没明白了这些句子的意思！

and fyl was nice and pointed out that the word 了 here does not sound right and should be omitted.
Is this because it is a negative sentence? (can 了 sometimes appear in negative sentences or usually not at all?)

Thanks!

 

[Skatinginbc]

I probably didn't understand the meanings of these sentences 我可能没明白这些句子的意思.
I probably haven't understood the meanings of these sentences 我可能尚未(or 還没)明白这些句子的意思. ==> The sense of "perfect tense" is conveyed by an adverb 'yet' (i.e., 尚, 還) instead of 了.
我就不明白了, 為什麼"了"不可以用於否定句 ==> In fact, 了 can be used in negative sentences (e.g., 我就不明白了).
我到底哪里没明白了? ==> 了 can be used in negative sentences in conjunction with 没.

I'm not able to explain why 了 does not sound good in your sentence. All I can say is that not all negative sentences bar the use of 了.

 

[retrogradedwithwind]

Oh, the reason that baosheng inserted 了 into his sentence is, as skating explained above, to convey the sense of perfect sense.
I learned something new.

我刚吃了饭。right
我刚没吃了饭。wrong

明白了你的意思。right
没明白了你的意思。wrong

不知道你的意思。right
不知道了。right
不知道你的意思了。right
不知道了你的意思。wrong

Perhaps, just my guess, 了can be used in negative sentence but cannot directly connect a noun.（不能直接加宾语... cannot say it in English ）

 

[SuperXW]

I always stress that one crucial function of 了 is to signify the completion of the action, the situation, etc. Therefore, it is usually used to finish the sentence, so it's natural to see it at the end of the sentence.
[我明白]了。
[我不明白]了。
[知道你的意思]了。
[不知道你的意思]了。

In positive sentences, 了 can still signify the completion of the action, so it can be added directly to the verb. (The object can be considered as supplimentary information.)
我 [明白]了 你的意思。

However, in negative sentences, the action is not done. It will be weird to mark its "completion" right after it.
我 [不明白]了 你的意思。

But the whole thing can be considered as a result or conclution. 了 can be added after the whole sentence.
（因为你讲得不清楚，所以我）[不知道你的意思]了。

 

[zhg]

agree with SuperXW, nice explaination! Baosheng，if I am not mistaken if you were trying to say"I havent understood ..." then in this case,还没seems to be a good fit.

 

[Skatinginbc]

Why does 其实我可能没明白这些句子的意思了 still sound wrong?

 

[brofeelgood]

When a phrase of negation suggests a different outcome is yet possible, 了 mustn't be used. 还没/还不 is one such case.
- I haven't had my dinner (I might yet have it).
- 我还没吃晚饭.
- 我还没明白这些句子的意思.

And *maybe* if there is clear indication that this would be or may be the final result, 了 can be deployed to show a decision has been made, or a course of action has been taken, rendering the outcome more or less unequivocal.
- I'm skipping dinner. / I may skip dinner.
- 我不吃晚饭了. / 我可能不吃晚饭了.
- 那我(可能)就不明白这些句子的意思了.

 

[Ghabi]

我就不明白了, 為什麼"了"不可以用於否定句 ==> In fact, 了 can be used in negative sentences (e.g., 我就不明白了).

This le here is the utterance-final particle le, not the aspect marker le (compare Cantonese 我就唔明白喇(laa3)), and is thus different than, for example *不明白了一件事情 (compare Can. *唔明白咗(zo2)一件事), where le is an aspect marker.

 

[yuechu]

I've learnt a lot about the Chinese language from your replies. Thanks, everyone, for your help! ^^

 

[learntheworld]

In my opinion,
我没明白这句话。
我没明白这句话了。 It's like 我没（有在）明白这句话了。(I'm not understanding this sentence now ????? Incorrect)
明白 (understand) is a stative verb. It seems that usually we don't use its progressive tense.

我没（有在）看星星了。(I'm not looking at the stars now.)
我没（有在）练习书法了。(I'm not practising calligraphy now.)

As to 我没明白了这句话 (incorrect)，I just know that the rule may be like this, if we want to say
I don't understand this sentence. 我不明白这句话/我没明白这句话。
I didn't understand this sentence. 我（以前）不明白这句话/我（以前）没明白这句话。
I haven't understood this sentence. 我没明白过这句话 or 我还没明白这句话。
You may also refer to other members' helpful posts above. It's difficult for me to explain.
It's my personal opinion for your reference only.