起:只要关闭起大门

Konstantinos

Senior Member
Greek - Athens
只要关闭起大门,四合院内便形成一个封闭式的小环境。

Hi all. This is from the Standard Course Book of HSK5, section 14.

What is the meaning of 起?

提前感谢。
 
  • azhong

    Senior Member
    Traditional Chinese
    Agreed. 起 is an abbreviation for 起來. And "Verb+起來" and its variations (by rearranging the word order) mean "start Ving".
     

    Konstantinos

    Senior Member
    Greek - Athens
    Thank you all for your answers.

    问题是“只要”和“起”很不符合我心里。只要 has duration, 起 happens once.

    只要(as long as (duration))关闭(close)起(starts (it happens once))大门(the big door).

    As long as the door starts closing...

    How can an instant event (starting closing) have duration (as long as)?
     

    retrogradedwithwind

    Senior Member
    Chinese
    According to 汉典网, I think 起 here means
    用在动词后,表示动作的趋向:想~。掀~。兴(xīng )~。
    Not
    用在动词后,与“来”连用,表示动作开始:唱~来。

    And again, what we usually say is 关起大门, not 关闭起大门. We usually say 闭上大门.
     

    SimonTsai

    Senior Member
    Taiwanese Mandarin
    1660428047763.png
     

    azhong

    Senior Member
    Traditional Chinese
    Agreed with Simon.

    關起大門 is indeed an one-monent action, but then it's also a continuous state.
    Chinese is very flexible, isn't it?

    Or you can see it this way:

    只要关闭起大门 之後,四合院内便形成一个封闭式的小环境。

    ...之後:after...
     

    azhong

    Senior Member
    Traditional Chinese
    According to 汉典网, I think 起 here means
    "用在动词后,表示动作的趋向:想~。掀~。兴(xīng )~。"
    [but] Not
    "用在动词后,与“来”连用,表示动作开始:唱~来。"
    动作的趋向 和 动作开始 兩者的細微差異在哪?我不太明白。
    開始之後不就是有個方向、有個趨向了嗎?再者,有了趨向不就是已經開始了嗎?
    好吧,我不懂。我個人還是傾向於暫時歸為同一類。
    And again, what we usually say is 关起大门, not 关闭起大门. We usually say 闭上大门.
    So, you are also criticising the quality of the text? The text uses 关闭起大门 and you says it's not idiomatic. XD

    不過我們台灣這邊口語好像多用 關上大門。 閉上大門 聽起來像是寫在文章裡的 文學用語。
     

    azhong

    Senior Member
    Traditional Chinese
    "(问题是“只要”和“起”)很不符合「我心里」"

    「不符合我心裡」不是通順的中文。Its English translation is?
     

    benjamin zhong

    Member
    Chinese
    "(问题是“只要”和“起”)很不符合「我心里」"

    「不符合我心裡」不是通順的中文。Its English translation is?
    “只要”和“起”没有关联,不存在翻译问题。“只要”修饰整个小句“关闭起大门”。“起”表延续状语的状态,或重复的动作,使用非常广泛。“走起路来,虎虎生威”、“笑起来,真的很让人着迷”。
    Thank you all for your answers.

    问题是“只要”和“起”很不符合我心里。只要 has duration, 起 happens once.

    只要(as long as (duration))关闭(close)起(starts (it happens once))大门(the big door).

    As long as the door starts closing...

    How can an instant event (starting closing) have duration (as long as)?
    “起” does not mean happen once. It is a Chinese marker for continuous aspect.
     

    retrogradedwithwind

    Senior Member
    Chinese
    So, you are also criticising the quality of the text? The text uses 关闭起大门 and you says it's not idiomatic. XD
    说了好多好多次了。这些hsk文章不是“有错”,而是“不够好”。希望你能理解什么叫“不够好”。——说一篇文章“不够好”,就是要“咬文嚼字”“吹毛求疵”的。

    动作的趋向 和 动作开始 兩者的細微差異在哪?我不太明白。
    这是字典给出的解释。既然字典分别给出了释义,说明在字典编纂者眼里,这是两个含义。其区别,就我看,主要在于:表动作趋向时,起字单用缀于动词之后,如兴起、掀起;表动作开始时,与“来”连用组成“起来”一词,如“唱起来”。更详细的区分,恐怕要问专业人士了。
     

    azhong

    Senior Member
    Traditional Chinese
    问题是“只要”和“起”很不符合我心里。只要 has duration, 起 happens once.
    Edit: Cons made a Chinese sentence here. And the sentence is unnatural to me. I was asking what he meant by asking the English version of "不符合我心里".

    Or maybe his expression goes natural in PRC?
    "這結果(不)符合我心里",這句子在大陸通順嗎?
     

    Kimmi G

    Senior Member
    Chinese
    解释我们习以为常的汉语知识真是太难了。大家觉得有没有可能是这个意思?

    57. 用在动词后。表示动作涉及到某事物。
    • 《京本通俗小说·错斩崔宁》:“大娘子说道:‘不要说起三年之久,也须到小祥之后。’”
    • 《醒世恒言·卖油郎独占花魁》:“问起根由,至亲三口,抱头而哭。”
    • 《歧路灯》第八回:“不得已,引起董氏,逃走省城,投奔他的亲戚。”
    • 周立波《山乡巨变》上一:“婆婆一年喂起两栏猪,也落得几个。”
    出处:《汉语大词典》
     

    Konstantinos

    Senior Member
    Greek - Athens
    After much and deep grammatical thinking, here is my final try that makes sense:

    只要关闭起大门

    as long as closed has been started being the big door
     

    Shazhudao945

    Senior Member
    Chinese - Mainland China
    I don't think 关闭起 is a proper expression.

    Either 关上 or 关起 is right, but 关闭起 is definitely wrong. At least in mainland China.
     

    Shazhudao945

    Senior Member
    Chinese - Mainland China
    You seldom see 起 after a verb made up of two characters, especially in official media, because to put 起 after one character verb is the idiomatic way 起 is used。
     
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