말이 수도원이었지

*Louis*

Senior Member
Italian
Hello guys,

can you help me with this sentence please? Thanks!

말이 수도원이었지, 수사는 그 혼자뿐이었고 그는 염소 두 마리를 키우며 연명했다.

"At words it was only a monastery,...the investigator/Susa raised two sheep alone" ??

Louis
 
  • pcy0308

    Senior Member
    Korean
    Hello *Louis*,
    "수사" here means "수도사" or "a monk" in English. A person who enters a monastery, willingly deprives him or herself of worldly pleasures and follows religious paths.

    "It was a monastery only in name as the only monk living there was him along with his two goats."
    "It was a monastery only in name as he - the only monk present - lived there all alone with his two goats."
    "It was a monastery only in name. He was the only monk dwelling in the monastery, tending his two goats."

    Hope this helps!
     
    Last edited:

    CharlesLee

    Senior Member
    Korean
    Ciao Louis,

    I think that '수도사' could be priests in Korean. I thought it would be monks a couple mins ago but now I have a strong feeling

    that it could refer to priests in Korean.

    Please consider my opinions too.



    Hello guys,

    can you help me with this sentence please? Thanks!

    말이 수도원이었지, 수사는 그 혼자뿐이었고 그는 염소 두 마리를 키우며 연명했다.

    "At words it was only a monastery,...the investigator/Susa raised two sheep alone" ??

    Louis
     

    Rance

    Senior Member
    Korean
    "수사" here means "수도사" or "a monk" in English. A person who enters a monastery, willingly deprives him or herself of worldly pleasures and follows religious paths
    To add few more detail, 수사 refers to 남자 수도사.
    수도사 is gender neutral term.
    여자 수도사 is commonly known as 수녀.
    If 수도사 lives in monastery, he/she is also known as 수도승.
    Male 수도승 is called monk in English.

    (From Catholics News)

    Ciao Louis,

    I think that '수도사' could be priests in Korean. I thought it would be monks a couple mins ago but now I have a strong feeling

    that it could refer to priests in Korean.

    Please consider my opinions too.

    Monk is the correct translation.
    수사,or monk, simply refer to people who take a vow of poverty, chastity, and obedience.
    Priest in Catholic Church, 사제, refers to someone who has received rite of ordinance.
     
    Last edited:

    CharlesLee

    Senior Member
    Korean
    To add few more detail, 수사 refers to 남자 수도사.
    수도사 is gender neutral term.
    여자 수도사 is commonly known as 수녀.
    If 수도사 lives in monastery, he/she is also known as 수도승.
    Male 수도승 is called monk in English.

    (From Catholics News)



    Monk is the correct translation.
    수사,or monk, simply refer to people who take a vow of poverty, chastity, and obedience.
    Priest in Catholic Church, 사제, refers to someone who has received rite of ordinance.

    No, the word can refer to both monks and priests. 수사 means just religious principles. 사제 is just another same term.

    수도사 and 수도승's short term is 수사. Therefore, I think the context have the answer.

    Louis, the questioner asked if it's priests again and again. I feel that's because it could be priests.
     

    pcy0308

    Senior Member
    Korean
    Hello all,
    I am going to have to agree with Rance here and stick to what I have specified in the previous thread.
    I've already clarified (and it seems Louis, the questioner clearly understood and we all agree) that "수사" is just a shortened term for "수도사", so there is no dispute there.
    There seems to be a disagreement over which one is the more accurate representation/more precise English equivalent for "수사": "a monk" or "a priest".

    1) "A monk" or "a priest"
    I disagree that 수사 and 사제 are interchangeable, same terms. That is not true. A simple dictionary/web search will clarify this: check out the link below:
    What are the differences between priests and monks? - Quora

    Note the definition of "a monk" and "a priest" that Rance has already provided. I must say, his clarification accurately notes the difference between a priest and a monk. The link above or any other search results you may stumble upon on Google define them pretty much the same way.

    2) "수도원" or a monastery as a setting
    The sentence specifically mentions "수도원". In English usage, the term "수도원", translated as "monastery", is "the buildings of a community of monks" according to Oxford, Longman, Cambridge dictionaries, Wikipedia, etc. Really, it is a dead giveaway, and it should be clear why "a monk" would be the more accurate translation of "수사" for this sentence.

    (Also a quick, simple Google/Wikipedia search will clarify all those vocabularies and provide a better understanding of which of these words are more closely linked to each other: a monastery and a monk or a monastery and a priest

    3) "연명" and the dea of subsistence, stoicism, austerity in the sentence

    In addition, the phrase in itself and, most importantly, the word "연명" seem to reflect the idea of Stoicism, austerity, subsistence, a simple life without much extravagence. What the sentence is trying to say is not that this person in question is living a materialistic life or a life of affluence but quite the contrary. The very word the writer chose, "연명", refers to "subsistence". From this, it is possible to infer that the subject in question is leading a stoic, austere life - just like a monk who "take a vow of poverty, chastity, and obedience" - according to both Rance and religious scholars - again, easily searchable on the web.

    Bear in mind that a monk also may be pirest, and of course, priests can live in a monastery or a monk can dwell in a church, vice versa and etc. We can all say "priest" and "monk" are both catch-all phrases/words and can be used interchangeably, but I believe that is not the point here - rather, providing more accurate and precise definition for each of those words in English and Korean is. (Sure, "수사" can (only in some exceptional cases) be translated as a priest or any other religious professions for that matter, but let's focus on the sentence Louis has provided. "A monk" is without a doubt a more accurate representation of what the word "수사" refers to.)

    Also, nobody is asking whether the word in question is "priests again and again", and it seems like Louis, the questioner understood clearly what the word means and did not reply with any follow-up questions so I am lost where this is coming from.
     
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