a recent discussion

[ABBA Stanza]

Hi folks ,

On writing an E-Mail today, I hit upon the following problem. I wanted to write:

Eine <recent> Diskussion mit XYZ hat ergeben, dass ...

where <recent> is the German translation for "recent" in English. Unfortunately, I couldn't find such a translation . My first intuition, that maybe "neuliche" could be used here turned out to be false, as mentioned in this thread. Furthermore, the suggestion in the other thread was to use "aktuell". This works for the context in the other thread ("a recent study" -> "eine aktuelle Studie"), but does it work here? That is, can I say
"Eine aktuelle Diskussion mit XYZ hat ergeben, dass ..." when the discussion took place three days ago and is not ongoing?

If it doesn't work, what are the alternatives (if any)?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Cheers
Abba

 

[Dan2]

Could one say
Neulich hat eine Diskussion mit XYZ ergeben, dass ...
?

(But even if this works, maybe what you really want is to find an appropriate adjective.)

 

[Frank78]

I'd go for "kürzliche" or "neuliche". Perhaps it still sounds like a translation then. More naturally would be "Eine Diskussion mit XYZ letztens hat ergeben, dass..."

If you use "aktuelle" it will indeed sound like the discussion is ongoing.

Could one say
Neulich hat eine Diskussion mit XYZ ergeben, dass ...
?

(But even if this works, maybe what you really want is to find an appropriate adjective.)

I think when the adjetive stands on its own it does not sound very well. You have to add something like:

"Eine kürzlich/neulich geführte Diskussion hat ergeben, dass..."

 

[PaceFalmPG]

Neulich hat eine Diskussion mit XYZ ergeben, dass ...
Die Diskussion neulich mit XYZ hat ergeben, dass...
That's how I'd say it depending on the article you want to use.

 

[berndf]

Could one say
Neulich hat eine Diskussion mit XYZ ergeben, dass ...
?

(But even if this works, maybe what you really want is to find an appropriate adjective.)

In this case it is probably not very important but there is a semantic difference between your translation and the English original with an adjective: In the English sentence, the discussion took place recently; in your translation, only the result was been established recently which could in theory have occurred significantly later than the point in time when the discussion took place. If this semantic difference is important, you have to say something like what Frank suggested or the second of PaceFalmPG's suggestions. PaceFalmPG's first suggestion is semantically equivalent to your translation.

 

[fdb]

To say "rezente Diskussion" is also perfectly good German.

 

[Gernot Back]

To say "rezente Diskussion" is also perfectly good German.

You mean perfectly good Austrian and Swiss German.

http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/rezent#Bedeutung1b

I have never heard this word before and despite my knowledge of English I would probably not even understand this adjective in a German sentence.

 

[berndf]

Me neither; nor does my wife nor her sister who are Austrian. I also can't remember ever having heard it in Switzerland. And, according to the Duden entry quoted by Gernot, it means "contemporary" and not "recent".

 

[fdb]

"Die rezente Diskussion", "rezente Ereignisse" and the like are used quite a lot in academic discourse. You can look them up in "google scholar".

 

[Gernot Back]

I would say it is bad style and not worthy of a scholar to speak like that. It is due to unthoughtfulness when you simply form a non-existent ad-hoc adjectival attribute in German in analogy to another language, not considering the possibilities we already have in German, expressing the same idea with an estabilshed different kind of attribute, let's say a genitive attribute like in:

Die Diskussionen/Ereignisse der jüngsten Zeit.​

 

[fdb]

I would say it is bad style and not worthy of a scholar to speak like that. It is due to unthoughtfulness when you simply form a non-existent ad-hoc adjectival attribute in German in analogy to another language, not considering the possibilities we already have in German, expressing the same idea with an estabilshed different kind of attribute....

„Rezent“ is a long-standing Latinism in German. A random search of the Cambridge University Library catalogue revealed, for example:

Die Saugetiere : Einfuhrung in die Anatomie und Systematik der recenten und fossilen Mammalia, Jena 1904.

Die rezenten Kaustobiolithe und ihre Lagerstätten, Abh. d. k. preuss. geolog. Landesanstalt, N.F. 55, Berlin 1908.

etc.

 

[berndf]

Die Saugetiere : Einfuhrung in die Anatomie und Systematik der recenten und fossilen Mammalia, Jena 1904.

Die rezenten Kaustobiolithe und ihre Lagerstätten, Abh. d. k. preuss. geolog. Landesanstalt, N.F. 55, Berlin 1908.

These uses are obsolete or at least obsolescing and in both cases,

-> rezent does not mean recent but contemporary.
​

 

[fdb]

Maybe, but certainly not "a non-existent ad-hoc adjectival attribute".

 

[manfy]

Genauso wie Gernot und Bernd habe ich "rezent" noch nie gehört.
Die Beschreibung auf Wikipedia ist aber gut und ergiebt Sinn: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rezent
Demnach kann man dieses Wort wohl gut und gerne als Fachjargon für diverse auf Latein basierende Wissenschaften (Medizin, Biologie, etc.) einordnen.

 

[berndf]

Maybe, but certainly not "a non-existent ad-hoc adjectival attribute".

Agreed.

 

[Gernot Back]

Maybe, but certainly not "a non-existent ad-hoc adjectival attribute".

Rezent does not belong to everyday-language vocabulary in German, but if you speak of rezente Ereignisse and rezente Diskussion, you do use it in an everyday context, which is wrong.

I assume that people who do this, simply transfer an English word into German, neglecting the contexts, where it is appropriate to do so, thus creating nonce words. As far as this is done in full awareness of the inappropriate context, it is legitimate to insinuate that these people are trying to impress or even intimidate others with bombastic words. This is a well-known strategy among some "scholars" and probably the way how most technical terms come into being: by deliberate obscurantism.

< ... >

 

[berndf]

Rezent does not belong to everyday-language vocabulary in German, but if you speak of rezente Ereignisse and rezente Diskussion, you do use it in an everyday context, which is wrong.

Not wrong but obsolete, if we can trust Wikipedia in this.

I assume that people who do this, simply transfer an English word into German, neglecting the contexts, where it is appropriate to do so, thus creating nonce words.

I can't see any reason for such an assumption. The occurances of "rezente Diskussion" produced by Google are almost exclusively from Austria and are consistent with the characterization as an outdated "bildungssprachlich" use.

 

[Sowka]

Hello

Not wrong but obsolete, if we can trust Wikipedia in this.

But - as far as I can see now - the German "rezent" has never been a translation of the English word "recent", and in a modern context, in particular in Abba's sentence, it would certainly be inadequate and misleading.

Eine <recent> Diskussion mit XYZ hat ergeben, dass ...

I would either use one of the options given in posts #2, #3, #4 or write:

Neulich sprach ich mit XYZ (über dieses Thema), und wir kamen zu dem Ergebnis, dass...

 

[berndf]

But - as far as I can see now - the German "rezent" has never been a translation of the English word "recent"...

Not quote. there are valid attestations of the contrary. But this usage is obviously obsolete in Germany and obsolescing in Austria.

..., and in a modern context, in particular in Abba's sentence, it would certainly be inadequate and misleading.

Sure. We all agree on that.