betray Satan

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heather 1997

Senior Member
Cantonese-China
Last week I posted a message to an American friend and encouraged him to betray Satan and live a godly life. My friend said I can't say "betray Satan", because Satan is an evil thing. If we say "betray Satan", it implies Satan is good.
What's your opinion? Please help me! Thanks in advance.
 
  • owlman5

    Senior Member
    English-US
    "Renounce" makes more sense to me, heather: I encourage you to renounce Satan and live a godly life.:thumbsup:

    If you tell me that you "betrayed Satan", I'll believe that you broke one of your personal promises to Satan. That doesn't make any sense in the context you provided.
     

    Rhye

    Senior Member
    English - American
    It's even funnier (and more contrary to what you wanted to mean) if you consider this definition of betray...

    6. to show or exhibit; reveal; disclose:
    an unfeeling remark that betrays his lack of concern.

    So in certain contexts "betraying Satan" could mean resembling, or acting in accordance with, Satan. ;)
     
    I agree with owl that 'betray' is not quite right. "turn your back on" would be better.
    As owl hinted, there is an uncomplimentary suggestion in 'betray': That the person had a kind of pact with Satan, which you are calling on him to 'betray'.


    "Renounce" makes more sense to me, heather: I encourage you to renounce Satan and live a godly life.:thumbsup:

    If you tell me that you "betrayed Satan", I'll believe that you broke one of your personal promises to Satan. That doesn't make any sense in the context you provided.
     

    heather 1997

    Senior Member
    Cantonese-China
    thank all of you for your help!I don't think betray Satan means reveal or disclose Satan. My understanding is rebel against or revolt against Satan, for i have awakened.:)
     

    owlman5

    Senior Member
    English-US
    You're welcome, heather. "Betray Satan" does not really mean "rebel against Satan" or "revolt against Satan." It means "to violate some agreement/promise/pact that you made with Satan." So I don't think you should use "betray" in that sentence.

    You can use "rebel" or "revolt" if you think that people have been under the influence of Satan and that they should fight this influence.
     
    Last edited:

    Shimmer Dancer

    Senior Member
    Chinese
    What about "betray the flesh"? If I wish to say rebel against the flesh or forsake the flesh, can I use "betray"? Would "betray the flesh" have similar implication as "betray Satan"?
     
    Try to get an understanding of the standard usages of 'betray'. Look at a dictionary and its examples.
    Your proposed extensions don't work, and this suggests you need to gain a basic understanding of the word and concept.
    But keep at it and you will gain lots of knowledge.
     

    Hermione Golightly

    Senior Member
    British English
    The word usually used, if I have correctly understood you, and if I remember correctly, is in its basic form 'forsake the flesh' meaning to give up bodily and earthly pleasures, although 'carnal desires' and sex come to my mind first.
     

    Hermione Golightly

    Senior Member
    British English
    The person or whatever we betray is good from their point of view.
    The betrayer is bad in the eyes of the betrayed.
    To betray a person or entity you have to have some sort of relationship with them. If you betray your country you start working against it. If you betray your lover you hurt them by taking your love elsewhere. If you betray your god you stop following their teaching.
     
    Hermione's point is good as far as it goes. But 'betray' has in my view, also, the dimension of loyalty. Someone expects it; someone has expectations about me. By extension, an ideal or value can be said to 'demand loyalty.'

    If an acquaintance wants to rob a store, he asks me to be the look-out. I pretend to agree, but talk to the cops and help set him up. He's arrested during the robbery. He says, "You betrayed me." Note that the deed is not necessarily thought to be 'good', nor need my acquaintance think of himself as 'good'. But he expects if we make an agreement, I'll honor it. (So to say, 'honor among thieves' [who are bad people]).

    By extension, if I'm committed to supporting myself, working hard, and not being a moocher, I 'betray' that ideal if I take to robbing stores
    to get money to live on. In this case, Hermione's point stands since I probably say that the self-supporting ideal is a good thing to have; that's why I call it an ideal of mine. However, in this case, 'relationship' does not exactly apply. I hold up the ideal, subscribe to it. The normal expectation is of follow through. IF I don't do that, I 'betray' it by failing to follow through. I don't 'disappoint' it or cause its ruin as in my first example. I suppose I might 'disappoint' myself.

    And to re-iterate, 'betraying the flesh' or 'betraying my own flesh' has, without context, no clear meaning. IF the police have put a price on my mother's head since she murdered someone, and I turn her in, then I might be said to be 'betraying my own flesh and blood.'


    The person or whatever we betray is good from their point of view.
    The betrayer is bad in the eyes of the betrayed.
    To betray a person or entity you have to have some sort of relationship with them. If you betray your country you start working against it. If you betray your lover you hurt them by taking your love elsewhere. If you betray your god you stop following their teaching.
     
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