buried under the confusion

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jalaluddin

Senior Member
India - Hindi & English
Hi, Experts, I want to get checked the below paragraph.

Shepherd look after the herd of dogs, sheep and goat. But most useful dogs are kept / tamed by saint whose monasteries are on Alps mountain. Human beings are oftenly get stuck in heavy snow storm during the travelling on Alps. And are pushed to be buried alive by snow's big slides during snowfalls.

Dogs find these type of alive and save them. These dogs are called "Saint
Barnard" dog.


( are buried alive by big slides of snow during heavy falls)

Which would be better ?


I have mentioned here entire context so It would be easier for you to tell.
 
  • Copyright

    Senior Member
    American English
    -- and can be buried alive by avalanches during heavy snowfalls.

    "can" suggests the possibility of being buried alive, while "are" says that they are. Since not all people are buried alive, I would recommend "can."

    I'm also using a dash to connect it with the previous, related sentence. Otherwise, there is no subject to the last sentence.
     

    jalaluddin

    Senior Member
    India - Hindi & English
    And are pushed to be buried alive by snow's big slides during snowfalls.
    Does this sentence (grammar structure) make the proper sense ?
     

    Hermione Golightly

    Senior Member
    British English
    And are pushed to be buried alive by snow's big slides during snowfalls.
    There are several problems with your sentence which Copyright has already explained in his post and indicated in his suggestion below:

    -- and can be buried alive by avalanches during heavy snowfalls.
    1. Your proposed sentence is not a sentence because the verb structure
    " are pushed to be buried " has no subject.

    ( "are pushed to be buried" is not grammatical either)

    2. A sentence should not start with 'and' or 'but'. Learners should always observe this rule. 'And' is a conjunction which is used to join grammar items.

    You have two options: either drop the 'and' and then provide a subject to make a complete and correct sentence structure, or, keep the 'and' and change the punctuation so it is no longer trying to be a sentence on its own. It will be joined by 'and' to the previous clause.



    Human beings are oftenly get stuck in heavy snow storm during the travelling on Alps. And are pushed to be buried alive by snow's big slides during snowfalls.

    Human beings oftenly:cross: get stuck........................ travelling on Alps:cross: and can get buried alive by avalanches during snowfalls.
    or
    Human beings oftenly:cross: get stuck........................ travelling on Alps:cross:. They can get buried alive by avalanches during snowfalls.

    They is the pronoun subject of the new sentence. It refers back to the named subject of the previous sentence, 'human beings'

    I hope you appreciate the help you get here.

    Hermione




     
    Last edited:

    jalaluddin

    Senior Member
    India - Hindi & English
    are pushed to be buried alive by snow's big slides during snowfalls.

    If we add here "They" pronoun. The intense behind writing this format, THEY = Means = People are pushed by avalanches (by the heavy force of snow slides. They rushed towards people)and people get the situation of being buried or It make the situation for people to have buried alive.

    Some people can be alive or some can be dead in this situation. This missed people
    are found by those smart dogs.

    Here, I have tried to make two passive in a sentence as well.

    are pushed and get buried. In both format subject is almost same. In first,
    Force can be considered as a subject and other avalanches can be considered
    as a subject. Or else buried function as an adjective.

    People are pushed to get/be buried by avalanches.

    I understood I just wanted to check this double passive format checked. Your support is always admirable. You people are the real English guru (guru means teacher). We love you.
     

    Copyright

    Senior Member
    American English
    I think part of the confusion comes from the fact that we don’t push people to bury them – we just bury them and make the assumption they were pushed or overwhelmed.

    And we speak of avalanches as the fast-moving snow you’re talking about.

    So we might say:
    The avalanche pushed the climbers off the ridge.
    The avalanche buried the skiers.

    You could use “snow” in place of “avalanche” there, but it doesn't conjure up the same mental image. And I do think you’re talking about avalanches – the sudden breaking away of large amounts of snow with often catastrophic results – rather than just snowfall.

    Other things that stand out for me: Shepherds don’t herd dogs; they use dogs to help them herd. The most useful dog is not the St. Bernard – shepherds and soldiers would disagree, naturally; so it’s better to find a different adjective. Monks live in monasteries, not saints.

    You’ve worked hard enough on this that I’m willing to make a suggestion, but understand that we’re really not supposed to do so much. And with that comment, here’s a thought:

    Shepherds use dogs to help them look after their flocks of goats and sheep. But perhaps the most special dogs are kept in the monasteries in the Alps mountains, where people are often caught by heavy snowstorms and sometimes buried alive by avalanches. The monks’ St. Bernard dogs are often able to find these people and save them.
     
    Last edited:

    jalaluddin

    Senior Member
    India - Hindi & English
    wonderful. thanks. Could you focus on that double passive pattern, whether it is right or wrong or needs a bit repairing
     

    Thomas Tompion

    Senior Member
    English - England
    wonderful. thanks. Could you focus on that double passive pattern, whether it is right or wrong or needs a bit repairing
    They were pushed to be buried alive means they had great trouble getting themselves buried alive: i.e. the snow was very reluctant to fall on them, for some reason.

    I've already warned you about that formula, Jalaluddin. You need to avoid it, and passives in general, if you wish to be clear and to persuade people to read what you write.
     

    Hermione Golightly

    Senior Member
    British English
    I've already warned you about that formula, Jalaluddin. You need to avoid it, and passives in general, if you wish to be clear and to persuade people to read what you write.
    I couldn't agree more. Passives weaken the strength of the language and lack drama and immediacy. You really should be focusing on basics instead, getting the common little words like 'often' right.

    I wonder if you would like 'swept away' instead of 'pushed'. The idea is that an avalanche is like a brush. Brushes sweep away the dirt, or move it to another place.

    Passive

    People are (swept away and) buried alive (in snow) by avalanches.

    Active
    Avalanches bury people alive ( in snow).
    Avalanches sweep people away and bury them alive (in snow).

    Good luck with your writing! :) "Practice makes perfect"

    Hermione
     

    jalaluddin

    Senior Member
    India - Hindi & English
    Passives are tough pattern. Do you have any more interesting threads which contain the different pattern and rules about passive.

    As a learner I am eager to know it. Because The people who are already polished (well known) in English They intentionally use tough patterns of passive to make others impress. It happens here. Sometimes, when we go for any legal works, Passive are used by lawyers, Even in news papers. It is itself uncommon. I think It might be the reason that people like to use them.

    Once again thanks for your warm response.
     
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