call

    • Whom are you calling ?

    'Who' is technically incorrect but extremely widely used.

    You could also say, 'To whom are you making the call ?'...
     
    No really, my dear fellow, surely not?

    'Whom' went out with the ark didn't it? I'm all for saving the difference between might and may (lovely recent example in my local paper 'Dead man may have been alive'!) but surely there's no saving whom?
     
    Try telling that to Hemingway.

    I am reminded of the hilarious finale at the end of the recent British TV program (yes, I prefer the traditional English spelling to the -mme alternative), 'Grumpy Old Men', when the old codger who's been sitting in his armchair, lsitening to the song, 'Who d'you think you are Kidding, Mr Hitler...', eventually bolts up and shouts at the screen, 'IT'S WHOOOM !!!'...

    And by the way, I also pronounce the 'h' in that word, in case you were wondering !

    ;)
     
    winklepicker said:
    No really, my dear fellow, surely not?

    'Whom' went out with the ark didn't it? I'm all for saving the difference between might and may (lovely recent example in my local paper 'Dead man may have been alive'!) but surely there's no saving whom?
    Click to expand...

    As a foreigner I don't see the point in the 'dead man' sentence but it sounds interesting.

    So could you please explain the difference between may and might in that sentence to me?
    nurdug51
     
    nurdug51 said:
    As a foreigner I don't see the point in the 'dead man' sentence but it sounds interesting.

    So could you please explain the difference between may and might in that sentence to me?
    nurdug51
    Click to expand...

    Hmm - I think you'd better start a new thread. I've got into trouble over this before!
     
    I got a question when I read the post.

    I think "call" can be used as an intransitive verb in the meaning of "shout".

    If so, is "Whom are you calling to" also possible, isn't it?

    I'm not sure though. I need your help.

    Thanks
     
    Yes, call can mean 'shout'. Still no 'TO' though.

    "Peter, call Marie in from the garden; supper's ready"

    Stick with "Who are you calling" and you will reflect most common usage (BE). Complicate it further and you're asking for trouble.
     
    Hi Winklepicker.

    I found "call to" in dictionary.com
    29.to speak loudly, as to attract attention; shout; cry: She called to the children.



    Considering the usage, I think "Whom are you calling to" is grammatically right and the meaning is "Whom are you shouting to".
     
    Ah, OK, maybe I see what you mean.

    I think it's back to context here. I've been assuming that you were talking about a telephone call - which maybe you aren't. If you are, then "who are you calling?" is exactly what a switchboard operator would say - so use it.

    If you are using it in the context of speaking in a raised voice/shouting, then it depends on the circumstances. Perhaps you can give us the context?

    In any case, 'Whom....to' is definitely wrong. 'To whom are you calling' is grammatically correct, but sounds very old-fashioned.
     
    Thanks winklepicker.

    I agree with you about "Who are you calling?"

    Maybe, "call to" is not commonly used.

    This might be for fun.
    I remember that I heard "call to" in the movie "Terminator 2" and found by chance that short part in website.
    http://phattie.net/dawg_wavs/term2/calljohn.wav

    Actually when I heard "call to" and "call" during the movie, I was a little bit suprised.
     
    sjhrshin said:
    Actually when I heard "call to" and "call" during the movie, I was a little bit surprised.
    Click to expand...

    Yes, me too. (In this context, it appears that Mr Schwarzenegger is telling a woman to put in a telephone call to someone called John. He distinctly says, first, "Call to John" and then later, "Call John".)

    From a BE perspective, it sounds like a non-native English speaker making a mistake. I think "call to" might be a translation of a German expression.

    But there may be an AE alternative that I'm not aware of?

    Incidentally, more common in BE would be 'ring John'.
     
    Thanks

    Actually at the scene, John was hiding near his mother Sarah Conner and T-1000 (terminator) and T-1000 was urging her to call John giving torture.

    After looking the word "call" in the dictionary, I tentatively understood the second "call to" meant "shout to".


    winklepicker said:
    'To whom are you calling' is grammatically correct, but sounds very old-fashioned.
    Click to expand...

    Because of the different meaning between two, I don't think you suggested "who are you calling instead of "To whom are you calling?"
    Do you think then I should use "To whom are you shouting?" in the meaning of "To whom are you calling?"


    Also, I have thought "To whom ----" is better than "Whom ----- to"
    But you said "Whom --- to" is definitely wrong. This may be recurrent issue about the ending with preposition (I have seen similar argument in this forum)
     
    sjhrshin said:
    Thanks

    Actually at the scene, John was hiding near his mother Sarah Conner and T-1000 (terminator) and T-1000 was urging her to call John giving torture.

    After looking the word "call" in the dictionary, I tentatively understood the second "call to" meant "shout to".

    Also, I have thought "To whom ----" is better than "Whom ----- to"
    But you said "Whom --- to" is definitely wrong. This may be recurrent issue about the ending with preposition (I have seen similar argument in this forum)
    Click to expand...

    English is dynamic not fixed. I can only give you my opinion from my perspective. I am a native English speaker in my fifties, and I never (that's NEVER) use 'whom' - either written or spoken. To me, it sounds like something out of the 19th century.

    Others may disagree, but if you're looking for current idiomatic English as it is most commonly used in the UK, jettison 'whom' and be grateful for one less thing to remember!
     
    Thanks Wrinklepicker

    I thought you concerned about the location of preposition, not the use of whom.

    I might ask you too agressively and make simple things complicated.
    Thank you for your kind comments and I will keep those in mind.

    Thanks again.

    sjhrshin
     
    I think the last nail in the coffin for whom was people saying in a haughty tone: "whom shall I say is calling?" It's use lost all credibility.
     
    winklepicker said:
    [...]
    Others may disagree, but if you're looking for current idiomatic English as it is most commonly used in the UK, jettison 'whom' and be grateful for one less thing to remember!
    Click to expand...

    xarruc said:
    I think the last nail in the coffin for whom was people saying in a haughty tone: "whom shall I say is calling?" It's use lost all credibility.
    Click to expand...
    It's perhaps because I am on the outer fringes of BE, but whom is alive and well in my world. Now admittedly, that is a somewhat atypical world, populated by people who speak in sentences and use the subjunctive completely unselfconsciously. But we also use whom in many contexts. You'll find my posts littered with examples - usually in something like "... there are many people for whom the use of whom comes completely naturally."

    Turning to the example quoted for this thread:
    "Who are you calling to?"

    First the terminal to.
    If this is about a telephone call, drop the to. It is not normal in that context.
    If you are calling to a friend across the valley, the to is fine. It might sound more natural to replace call with shout.
    Who are you shouting to?
    Who are you shouting at?

    However, speaking as a whom-user, nothing on earth would persuade me to use whom in this sentence.
     
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