Chapter two has you start writing stand-alone Python scripts ...

Discussion in 'English Only' started by This_Is_Patrick, Jan 6, 2019.

  1. This_Is_Patrick Senior Member

    Parsi
    As I was reading a particular book within the realm of python programming, a sentence attracted my interest.
    The sentence is "Chapter two has you start writing stand-alone Python scripts ...". My question is all about its structure. It sounds unnatural to me, particularly the position of "has". Can you explain it more? Is such a pattern natural to you? I am also a bit confused about its meaning! Does it mean "Chapter 2 makes you start ..."? Thanks.
     
  2. grassy

    grassy Senior Member

    Warsaw
    Polish
  3. This_Is_Patrick Senior Member

    Parsi
    I am not sure, but I don't think that it's a simple causative "have". Because the verb that comes after causative have should be in the form of past participle.
    The complete sentence : "Chapter two has you start writing stand-alone Python scripts and script tools and using them in ArcMap and ArcCatalog."
     
  4. Edinburgher Senior Member

    Scotland
    German/English bilingual
    It's kind of causative, if the use in grassy's thread is. Or perhaps you could call it resultative. The meaning is that if you follow the instructions and exercises in the second chapter (after presumably also having duly worked through the first chapter), then it (the chapter, but really they, its authors) will have (or will have achieved) the result that you will be successfully writing Python scripts.
     
  5. This_Is_Patrick Senior Member

    Parsi
  6. PaulQ

    PaulQ Senior Member

    UK
    English - England
    It is a straightforward causative:
    [Any subject] <have/has, etc.> [any object] <infinitive [+object, if required]>
    ......I.....................had.................him.............cut..............their hair
    .....it....................will have...........you.............start...........writing Python
     
  7. This_Is_Patrick Senior Member

    Parsi
    Thank you dear @PaulQ for your answer. I got it. I think the causative have can be in the form of the following structures:
    have + object + past participle – have something done
    have + object + infinitive (as you just said) – have someone do something
    Right? I thought that the causative 'have' should have been followed only by a PP, which in fact I was mistaken!
     
  8. coiffe

    coiffe Senior Member

    USA
    American English
    If you look up the word "have" in the dictionary, you will find a million meanings and usages, of course. It's one of the most versatile verbs/auxiliaries in the English language. But one of the meanings is simply "to cause." Paul's example of "I had him cut their hair" is a good example. Or, "She had her assistant put the suitcase in the trunk." What's tricky here is that "have" in this sense is often followed by a present participle:

    After we trained him, we quickly had him scoring 250 every time he played.

    Therefore the question arises: Why, in the original sentence, didn't it say "Chapter Two has you starting with ..." or Paul's "will have you start writing Python"?

    The answer is probably quite simple -- the author wanted to use both "start" and "write."

    But it's worth pointing out that one structure involves an infinitive complement (without "to") -- "Ch. 2 has you start writing Python scripts"; and the other structure involves the participial *has you writing Python scripts." They're both grammatically correct.
     
  9. PaulQ

    PaulQ Senior Member

    UK
    English - England
    That is the causative passive:

    His brother built his house -> indicative
    He had his brother build his house -> causative indicative
    His house was built by his brother -> passive
    He had his house built by his brother -> causative passive.
     
  10. This_Is_Patrick Senior Member

    Parsi
    Thank you so much my friend @coiffe . You've clarified the matter very well.
    I know my questions may sound naive to you, but questions need to be answered.
    Many thanks @PaulQ for your response and great example.
     
  11. coiffe

    coiffe Senior Member

    USA
    American English
    Patrick, thanks for what you said in your last post. But your question was not at all naive. I didn't mean to imply that when I guessed why the Python author wrote the way he did. On the contrary, your questions were on one of the most difficult topics in modern English grammar -- complementation. Very few people want to talk about it, because it's so complicated. So please don't think that I found your questions naive. Not in the least.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2019
  12. Edinburgher Senior Member

    Scotland
    German/English bilingual
    But the original sentence did use Paul's version, except for the difference between "has" and "will have".
    Agreed (except that the author used "writing", not "write"). Specifically, I think the author meant that chapter two will get you to the stage at which you will be able to write Python scripts, but of course you will still not be proficient; you will still be a beginner, you will just be starting out, you will have started your Python-writing "career".
     

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