Comma vs. And

nagomi

Senior Member
Korean
"The Toronto neighbourhood known as Cabbagetown was razed in the process of creating Regent Park; the nickname Cabbagetown is now applied to the historical, upscale area north of the housing project."


When do you choose comma instead of "and"?

Is this just a matter of style, or is there any difference in meaning?

source: Regent Park - Wikipedia
 
  • PaulQ

    Senior Member
    UK
    English - England
    The comma is used with two or more adjective or adverbs that qualify the noun separately:

    the historical, upscale area-> the historical area which is also an upscale area. "The population of the historical, upscale area of Seoul has the hghest income."
    the historical upscale area -> the area that was, at some time in history, upscale. Historical qualifies upscale. "Park Lane was the historical upscale area of London, but the present upscale area is Mayfair."
    the historical and upscale area -> there might be two areas: one is historical, one is upscale. "We have divided the town into areas: the industrial, the rural, the commercial, the historical, and the upscale. The historical and upscale area both need investment."
     
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    nagomi

    Senior Member
    Korean
    The comma is used with two or more adjective or adverbs that qualify the noun separately:

    the historical, upscale area-> the historical area which is also an upscale area. "The population of the historical, upscale area of Seoul has the hghest income."
    the historical upscale area -> the area that was, at some time in history, upscale. Historical qualifies upscale. "Park Lane was the historical upscale area of London, but the present upscale area is Mayfair."
    the historical and upscale area -> there might be two areas: one is historical, one is upscale. "We have divided the town into areas: the industrial, the rural, the commercial, the historical, and the upscale. The historical and upscale area both need investment."

    Thank you, PaulQ!
     

    nagomi

    Senior Member
    Korean
    The comma is used with two or more adjective or adverbs that qualify the noun separately:

    the historical, upscale area-> the historical area which is also an upscale area. "The population of the historical, upscale area of Seoul has the hghest income."
    the historical upscale area -> the area that was, at some time in history, upscale. Historical qualifies upscale. "Park Lane was the historical upscale area of London, but the present upscale area is Mayfair."
    the historical and upscale area -> there might be two areas: one is historical, one is upscale. "We have divided the town into areas: the industrial, the rural, the commercial, the historical, and the upscale. The historical and upscale area both need investment."

    As to "the historical and upscale area", does it also mean the area might be just one area with both qualities?

    I repeatedly read your examples to get the feel of them, and "the historical and upscale" still sound almost same as "the historical, upscale area." So I wondered if using "and" can mean both.
     

    PaulQ

    Senior Member
    UK
    English - England
    As to "the historical and upscale area", does it also mean the area might be just one area with both qualities?
    ... either that or two areas each with a separate quality - the context will help.
     

    dojibear

    Senior Member
    English - Northeast US
    When putting two adjectives before a noun, it is usually acceptable to use "and". But it is not the most common form.

    And there are two kinds of adjectives pairs before a noun. One pair requires a comma between them. The other pair connot have a comma between them.

    "Coordinate adjectives" independently describe the noun. Those require a comma. If you can (a) reverse their order, or (b) put "and" between them, with no change in meaning, they are coordinate adjectives:

    a tall, fat man (a fat, tall man) (a tall and fat man )
    a bright, sunny day

    "Cumulative adjectives" work together. Reversing order or inserting "and" changes the meaning. These don't get a comma between them.

    The former secret agent
    A grey wool sweater (a sweater made of grey wool)
    An important historical landmark
     
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