Did you know/ Have you known? (BE)

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KonradBade

Senior Member
German
Hey,

I was wondering what BE speaking people would ask and how you would form the answer:

Paul: "Hey John, have you known that Harald has a very bad disease?"
John: "Oh, no, I didn't know so far! When did you get to know that?"
Paul: "His mum told me last thursday. I have been shocked since that moment!"

or 2nd version

Paul: "I have been knowing it for some time now. I am still shocked!"


I think the question has a meaning like "up to now", therefore it should go with "have", right?
"I didn't know so far" feels like the same... but NOW you know it so it's completed in a way, too.... so what's more important? and what's about all the other tenses?

Thanks for any help! :)
 
  • sandpiperlily

    Senior Member
    Hey,

    I was wondering what BE speaking people would ask and how you would form the answer:

    Paul: "Hey John, [B]have[/B] you known did you know that Harald has a very bad disease?" (
    John: "Oh, no, I didn't know so far! When did you get to know that find that out?"
    Paul: "His mum told me last Thursday. I have been shocked since that moment!"

    or 2nd version

    Paul: "I have been knowing have known it for some time now. I am still shocked!"
    Disclaimer: I'm American, so I can't speak for BE folks... but as far as I know, the stuff I crossed out would be incorrect on either side of the Atlantic.
     

    cyberpedant

    Senior Member
    English USA, Northeast, NYC
    Paul: "Hey John, have you known that Harald has a very bad disease?":cross:
    John: "Oh, no, I didn't know so far! When did you get to know that?":cross:
    Paul: "His mum told me last thursday. I have been shocked since that moment!"

    or 2nd version

    Paul: "I have been knowing it for some time now.:cross: I am still shocked!"

    I think the question has a meaning like "up to now", therefore it should go with "have", right?
    "I didn't know so far" feels like the same... but NOW you know it so it's completed in a way, too.... so what's more important? and what's about all the other tenses?
    As it's been ages since I last opened a German textbook, I'm guessing that your tense structures are only superficially similar to those of English. Most of your examples are not at all idiomatic in English.

    "have you known that Harald..." unless preceded by an adverbial phrase (like "how long") is simply "did you know?"
    "When did you get to know that?" is not exactly incorrect, but we'd say "when did you find that out?"
    "I have been knowing it" should be "I've known it..."
    "I have been shocked since that moment!" again, not grammatically wrong, but it's stating that you have been in a continual state of shock ever since you found out. A little over the top, no? :)
     

    KonradBade

    Senior Member
    German
    "have you known that Harald..." unless preceded by an adverbial phrase (like "how long") is simply "did you know?"
    "When did you get to know that?" is not exactly incorrect, but we'd say "when did you find that out?"
    "I have been knowing it" should be "I've known it..."
    "I have been shocked since that moment!" again, not grammatically wrong, but it's stating that you have been in a continual state of shock ever since you found out. A little over the top, no? :)

    Ah, okay, you mean you would have to say:
    "How long have you known that?" This would be present perfect continuos, right?

    So just: "I was shocked" or "I am still shocked"?
     

    djmc

    Senior Member
    English - United Kingdom
    In BE one would not say "a very bad disease" one would normally say "a very serious illness", or "is seriously ill".
     

    cyberpedant

    Senior Member
    English USA, Northeast, NYC
    Ah, okay, you mean you would have to say:
    "How long have you known that?" This would be present perfect continuous, right? :tick:

    So just: "I was shocked" or "I am still shocked"?
    "I was shocked" means at that particular past moment in time.

    "I am still shocked" means that you remain shocked at the present moment.

    Both are grammatically correct.
     

    Resa Reader

    Senior Member
    "How long have you known that?":tick: This would be present perfect continuous, right:cross:?
    The sentence is of course correct but it's not present perfect continuous but just plain present perfect.
    You can't use the progressive form of the present perfect with a stative verb like 'know'.

    I have known that for ages.:tick: / I have been knowing that for ages.:cross:

    PS: I've just seen that this is an old thread. So my post may not be relevant anymore.:)
     
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