dos apellidos, el del padre y el de la madre

[Konstantinos]

... Otaola Alday son mis apellidos españoles, dos porque como ya sabrás en España usamos dos apellidos, el del padre y el de la madre.

Please help me to literally translate this part:

el del padre y el de la madre

because I am lost.


el (the) del (from the) padre (father) y (and) el (the) de la (from the) madre (mother)

Maybe el means "the one" sometimes?

 

[S.V.]

Hello. Yes, 'the one' or 'that,' to help explain it. You understand a noun (el apellido), from the context. Two surnames, that of the father, that of the mother. See for ex. in CORPES (el d* * y el d* in Forma):

no sólo mancharías mi nombre; sino el de Antonella y el de Jonathan​

borró los números que había y escribió dos: "Son el de casa y el del móvil de Ra​

le pediría a la esposa que preparara su equipaje, el suyo, el de ella y el de las hijas (EN)​

You can see some dead combinations in 15.7n ('that in which'). El, la were 'stronger' marks. Yours works where Mine and yours! works.

 

[gengo]

el del padre y el de la madre

Sometimes English is more concise than Spanish.

We use two surnames, the father's and the mother's.

 

[Galván]

We use two surnames, that of the father, and that of the mother.

 

[dojibear]

Please help me to literally translate this part:

el del padre y el de la madre

"that of the father and that of the mother"

 

[OtroLencho]

We use two surnames, that of the father, and that of the mother.

"that of the father and that of the mother"

A grammatically-correct word-for-word translation that few native speakers would use outside of formal context.

In the provided context ("sabrás") I'd definitely lean towards Gengo's version.

 

[grindios]

A grammatically-correct word-for-word translation that few native speakers would use outside of formal context.

In the provided context ("sabrás") I'd definitely lean towards Gengo's version.

Agreed. I would never say "...that of..." and I never hear it said. I would say something like what Gengo mentioned, maybe even something like, "We use both our father's and mother's last name..."

 

[Galván]

Agreed. I would never say "...that of..." and I never hear it said. I would say something like what Gengo mentioned, maybe even something like, "We use both our father's and mother's last name..."

I'm surprised you've never heard it said grindios, when it appears in text books and just as OtroLencho said it's a a grammatically-correct word-for-word translation. Moreover, the OP is also very formal way of saying this, and not the most common, so why are you so opposed to the idea of using this translation?

 

[dojibear]

A grammatically-correct word-for-word translation that few native speakers would use outside of formal context.

That is what OP requested: a literal translation.

Please help me to literally translate this part:

el del padre y el de la madre

But I agree that "a literal translation" isn't "what people say in that language".

 

[gengo]

I'm surprised you've never heard it said grindios, when it appears in text books and just as OtroLencho said it's a a grammatically-correct word-for-word translation. Moreover, the OP is also very formal way of saying this, and not the most common, so why are you so opposed to the idea of using this translation?

The OP asked for a literal translation, so I suppose your version is just that. And while you are right that "that of X" is indeed correct and fairly common, it has a rather high register, and isn't something we say often in normal speech. So the natural translation would depend on the overall context. In a very formal situation, your "We use two surnames, that of the father, and that of the mother" could be appropriate, but it sounds too formal for most situations.

 

[Konstantinos]

Thank you all for your answers. Indeed the "that of" is exactly what I was looking for, it makes much sense to me, just the dictionaries (wiktionary) don't agree. They say that el means only "the", so "the one of the father and the one of the mother" is I think the best literal translation.

My opinion is that the literal translation of texts is the only way to really learn a language. At least, it has worked for me for learning Russian and Chinese.

 

[S.V.]

In the provided context ("sabrás") I'd definitely lean towards Gengo's version.

Oh, of course. After Konstantinos' literally, I'd say that s-genitive is the natural equivalent for most of the simple examples. The original and all the ones in CORPES are completely conversational. 'That and that' sounds more common with more complex examples, which can also give us an idea of why the Latin genitive died, under pressure.

(el de * * * y el d* in CORPES; EN, last one is broken, just like goat's milk yoghurt with cow )

poner dos mundos a la par: el del desarrollo tecnológico computarizado y el de la gente que toca de manera natural y tradicional​

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El texto se completaba en la coincidencia de dos registros: el de la gramática y el de la voz; el del español y el medellinense; el de la tradición literaria y el del chisme​

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las tres líneas de yogurt, el de leche de cabra, el de cabra con vaca y el de vaca solo, muy solicitados por la población​

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Uno de los problemas que estamos teniendo hoy en día en nuestro medio es precisamente que valores como la lealtad o como la honestidad, o la trasparencia, o la integridad, se han ido perdiendo, y más bien aparece el[/highlight] del dinero fácil, y el del dinero rápido y el de la trampa y el de no pagar impuestos y el de evadir, y ese tema que me parece a mí como tan delicado para una sociedad​