evidente impossibilità della nostra collaborazione

Lorena1970

Banned
Italy, Italiano
Hi all,

here it is.

Italian "Sono desolata (rattristata) dall' evidente impossibilità della nostra collaborazione"

English "I am sincerely sad by the evidence of our collaboration to be impossible"

The context is politely answering a message sent by a factory we hoped to collaborate with (they were supposed to spsonsor a project, but they told us they can't, clearly and politely explaining any details of their decision)
What I am interested in pointing out is the evidence of the impossibility to collaborate, shown by the clear and detailed text of their email.

Thank you!:)
 
  • TimLA

    Member Emeritus
    English - US
    The context is politely answering a message sent by a factory we hoped to collaborate with (they were supposed to spsonsor a project, but they told us they can't, clearly and politely explaining any details of their decision)
    What I am interested in pointing out is the evidence of the impossibility to collaborate, shown by the clear and detailed text of their email.
    Sono desolata (rattristata) dall' evidente impossibilità della nostra collaborazione"

    Wow there are many different ways to handle this.
    I'll try a few, but perhaps you might comment on:

    1. "collaborazione" in my opinion, is often a false friend, so if this is a business deal, then I'd vote for "cooperation".
    If it's and R&D project, then "collaboration" is a reasonable choice.

    2. The literal Italian translation is a bit forceful. I'll try to soften it a bit.

    Literal
    I am saddened by the evident impossibility of our cooporation.

    I am disappointed that we can't cooperate on this project.
    It is disappointing that we can't cooperate on this project.
    It is disappointing that we can't find a way to cooperate on this project.

    ??
     

    Lorena1970

    Banned
    Italy, Italiano
    Sono desolata (rattristata) dall' evidente impossibilità della nostra collaborazione"

    Wow there are many different ways to handle this.
    I'll try a few, but perhaps you might comment on:

    1. "collaborazione" in my opinion, is often a false friend (may you explain me why it is so? thanks), so if this is a business deal, then I'd vote for "cooperation". I agree, it's probably better though when there is a quite confidential relationship it always happens to use "collaboration" with BE people. It is probably "globish"? :D
    If it's and R&D (what is it a R&D project?) project, then "collaboration" is a reasonable choice.

    2. The literal Italian translation is a bit forceful.This was my suspect! I'll try to soften it a bit.

    Literal
    I am saddened by the evident impossibility of our cooporation.I like this one

    I am disappointed that we can't cooperate on this project.
    It is disappointing that we can't cooperate on this project.
    It is disappointing that we can't find a way to cooperate on this project.
    I am doubtful about using " to be disappointed" (see below)

    ??
    I think "disappointing" in this case may communicate sort of...disappointment (!!!) that in Italian is "delusione" and I am not sure it corresponds to the feeling I want to express. I would like to express sort of sadness mixed with regret, I mean something a bit stronger and more positive than disappointment. Or am I wrongly intrepreting the meaning of "disappointment"?:confused:
    THANK YOU!:)
     

    TimLA

    Member Emeritus
    English - US
    I think "disappointing" in this case may communicate sort of...disappointment (!!!) that in Italian is "delusione" and I am not sure it corresponds to the feeling I want to express. I would like to express sort of sadness mixed with regret, I mean something a bit stronger and more positive than disappointment. Or am I wrongly intrepreting the meaning of "disappointment"?:confused:
    THANK YOU!:)
    1. This is so interesting because of the use of different words, and how we interpret them through a "common" dictionary.:)
    "Disappointment" in this context is very common and just means "I wish we could have done it" "oh well, too bad" "I'm a little sad, but not too much".
    It's VERY common in business lingo.

    2. "Collaboration" is more commonly outside of business, and I've seen it used more in scientific contexts between "collaborators".
    In AE it has a tone of "we are working together on a project".
    So from my perspective, when I see "collaborazione" in an Italian sentence I often translate it as "cooperation" because it is the more common word in English - thus I think it's a false friend - like "prezioso" and "precious/valuable" that we see here on the forum all the time.:D

    My comments are for AE, I wouldn't know about BE.
     

    Lorena1970

    Banned
    Italy, Italiano
    Thank you all.:)
    TO TIM:
    Fisrt of all, thank you!
    1) "I am little sad, but not too much" this is what I thought "I am disappointed" meant (probably I didn't explain it properly). Instead, I wanted to express "I am VERY sad"

    2) Thanks. I understand the difference between "collaboration" and "cooperation", and let's say it works in Italian as well. Collaboration is more commonly used about "conceptual projects" than about business projects, about single people or human beings that collaborate putting together their minds and ideas instead of companies that cooperate putting together their money or business forces. It is a sligth difference, though it is a difference!
    In my case the project involved the resarch lab of a factory, so our deal was to be considered under a research point of view more than under a business one, that's why I thought I could use "collaboration".

    What do you think? Is there something else that express "deep sadness" (always refererred to a work collaboration/cooperation and not to sentimental feelings, of course! :D)
     
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    TimLA

    Member Emeritus
    English - US
    Thank you all.:)
    TO TIM:
    Fisrt of all, thank you!
    1) "I am little sad, but not too much" this is what I thought "I am disappointed" meant (probably I didn't explain it properly). Instead, I wanted to express "I am VERY sad"

    2) Thanks. I understand the difference between "collaboration" and "cooperation", and let's say it works in Italian as well. Collaboration is more commonly used about "conceptual projects" than about business projects, about single people or human beings that collaborate putting together their minds and ideas instead of companies that cooperate putting together their money or business forces. It is a sligth difference, though it is a difference!
    In my case the project involved the resarch lab of a factory, so our deal was to be considered under a research point of view more than under a business one, that's why I thought I could use "collaboration".

    What do you think? Is there something else that express "deep sadness" (always refererred to a work collaboration/cooperation and not to sentimental feelings, of course! :D)
    Very interesting!
    Then I would use "collaboration" because it's an R&D project.

    "Sad" is a word that probably would be used in a personal communication between friends and relatives (not always, but most likely).

    Let's try a few, and say what other foreros might say:
    More "general", "business-like"
    It is disappointing that we can't collaborate on this project.
    It is very disappointing that...
    I am dismayed that...

    More personal:
    It is saddening that...
    I am heartsick...
    I am personally disappointed that...
    I am disheartened that...
    It's been a let-down that...
    My heart is broken that...
    I'm distressed over the fact that...
    I'm dispondent that...


    I think I like the ones in blue.
    I'll be dispondent if we don't find a solution for you soon....:(:D
     

    Lorena1970

    Banned
    Italy, Italiano
    Thank you! I think we already have got many proper solutions!:)

    Its' just that I am curious to goo deep into subject in order to "feel" the verb/sentence that properly express my kind of "sadness" or regret!

    Even if it is something that has to do with job and business, I feel sad because the project was something very sperimental and unusual that I trust would have been successful in terms of communication and visibility,and also very satisfying if successfully made, i.e. it would have lead to talk a lot about how to change the common use of objects (cannot say more...;))

    But I still don't know what does it mean R&D...?

    Thanks!:)
     

    You little ripper!

    Senior Member
    Australian English
    I think translating that sentence literally sounds very unnatural in English, but I like Tim's can't work together on this project. I would use deeply saddened to translate desolata/rattristata.

    I am deeply saddened that we can't work together on this project.
     

    TimLA

    Member Emeritus
    English - US
    Thank you! I think we already have got many proper solutions!:)

    Its' just that I am curious to goo deep into subject in order to "feel" the verb/sentence that properly express my kind of "sadness" or regret!

    Even if it is something that has to do with job and business, I feel sad because the project was something very sperimental and unusual that I trust would have been successful in terms of communication and visibility,and also very satisfying if successfully made, i.e. it would have lead to talk a lot about how to change the common use of objects (cannot say more...;))

    But I still don't know what does it mean R&D...?

    Thanks!:)
    1. In terms of delving deeper into what words to use in a situation like this, it's important to have a clear idea the exact "level" you want to have the sentence to be read as.

    I've heard rumors that Italians are much more emotional that others :D, and express them more freely than we might in AE, and probably in AE, we are far more liberal in expressing feelings than in BE.

    So from an AE perspective:
    Formal business letter:
    We are disappointed that we cannot...
    We are deeply disappointed...

    Business communication to a friend/colleague:
    How sad it is that we cannot...

    Business email to a close friend:
    I'm so damned depressed that we can't...

    Other AE speakers would handle it differently (and rightly so), and our BE friends would do it MUCH differently.

    2. The phrase "R&D" is very important in AE, and one says "R and D". It's a fixed phrase meaning "Research and Development".
     
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    Lorena1970

    Banned
    Italy, Italiano
    Great explanation, Tim!:):cool:

    In effect I could have made an effort to realize about R&D...:(

    ...But now I wonder how BE people would do it, of course!!!;)

    BE people, toc...toc...is there anyone who wants to pay a tribute to this thread...???

    I think translating that sentence literally sounds very unnatural in English, but I like Tim's can't work together on this project. I would use deeply saddened to translate desolata/rattristata.

    I am deeply saddened that we can't work together on this project.
    Thank you! I like this one too. How many to choose, now...! :):):cool:
     
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