FR: Il est allé gagner à Brest

mzoghi

New Member
English
Google hasn't really been my friend with this one and my grammar books haven't been that much more help either, so I'm trying it hear.

The sentence is the following, and I found it on some news website:
Le PSG (ie Paris-Saint-Germain) est allé gagner à Brest, tout à l'heure 1 but à 0.

I think what they were saying was that some soccer team was beating another as the news was being broadcast. Could someone tell me what the form "être allé faire qqch" is called if it has a name (I just want to read more about it online: googling "être allé faire qqch" doesn't really get you very far) and is the meaning literally "was going to do sth"?

Also, assuming that the answer to the last question is yes, does "Il est allé gagner" have the same meaning as "Il était en train de gagner"? Also, the most reliable of translators, google :) , translates "He was going to win" as "Il allait gagner." I usually ignore google translate altogether, but I'm just wondering if they have a point in this case. If all three of these phrases are correct and mean the same thing, which one is preferable. Thanks lot and sorry this got a bit long.
 
  • janpol

    Senior Member
    France - français
    "Il est allé gagner" have the same meaning as "Il était en train de gagner"? NO, "Il allait gagner." NO
    "aller + verbe" = futur proche : je vais partir demain
    mais je pense que ton exemple n'est pas un futur proche
    l'OM est allé gagner à Brest = l'OM est allé à Brest (c'est là que le match a eu lieu) et a gagné ce match
     

    Frenchrescue

    Senior Member
    French
    Hello,

    I'll try to answer your questions.
    Aller + infinitif can be :
    a) the "futur proche" (google it to know more), in this case "aller" is an auxiliaire like "être" or "avoir". Example : "Je vais lire" (= I'm going to read). In this kind of sentence, "aller" loses its meaning of "to go somewhere". It just indicates an action which is coming soon.
    b) the contraction of "aller quelque part pour faire quelque chose" (to go somewhere to do something). In this kind of sentence, "aller" is conjugated like any other verb, and it retains its meaning of "going somewhere". Example : L'année dernière, je suis allé skier (I've gone skiing) ; dans deux ans, j'irai à nouveau skier (I'll go skiing).

    So don't mix the two ! In your sentence, it is the second case : The football team went to Brest and won.

    Of course you can use both at the same time (aller with futur proche + aller quelque part faire quelque chose) :
    Je vais aller faire des courses : I'm going to go shopping
    Je suis allé faire des courses : I have gone shopping (do you say that in English ?)

    So for your second question : "Il est allé gagner" and "Il était en train de gagner" are completely different : The first means "He went there and won", the second means "he was winning when.."

    Hope it will help you,

    French rescue
     

    Yuna Lisa

    New Member
    français / French (France)
    As a French, I think the sentence "Il est allé gagner à Brest" does sound a little bit ugly !

    I'm not very good at translating into English but I'm sure this is a past tense sentence : the PSG went to Brest and once there, they won the game. "They went to Brest and won".
     

    mzoghi

    New Member
    English
    Aaaaaaha! Thank you all. I was way off.

    What's funny is that this is the second time I'm posting something from this news website and someone's telling me that it's ugly: it's RFI. How would you say this more beautifully?

    Also, what is the verdict on "il allait gagner"? Is that proper French or just something google translate made up? Merci d'avance.
     
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    L'Inconnu

    Senior Member
    US
    English
    As a French, I think the sentence "Il est allé gagner à Brest" does sound a little bit ugly !

    I'm not very good at translating into English but I'm sure this is a past tense sentence : the PSG went to Brest and once there, they won the game. "They went to Brest and won".
    I am with you on this one.
     
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    Bachstelze

    New Member
    French - France
    It may be a bit of a neologism (le dictionnaire de l'Académie doesn't note this usage), but it doesn't strike me as particularly ugly, though that could be because I'm relatively young.

    "Il allait gagner" clearly means "he was about to win". For example "il allait gagner, mais il a chuté dans le dernier virage". It is totally correct.
     

    Enquiring Mind

    Senior Member
    English - the Queen's
    They had an away win at Brest, ....they won away at Brest, ....xxxx, playing away from home, beat Brest
    It may be ugly, but it's absolutely standard journalese in sports reporting.
     

    John McCloud

    Member
    French - France
    Depending on the context, it might mean the PSG football team really needed a victory after a series of unsuccessful matches and they did everything they could do to win that difficult but crucial match. "Il est allé chercher la victoire à Brest."
    But without any more context, I think it just means it was an away match. That is another way of saying : "Le PSG a gagné à l'extérieur, à Brest", avoiding the repetition of the adverbials of place "à l'extérieur / à Brest".
    Finally, it doesn't sound "ugly" to my French ears. I found it rather clear and concise.
     

    janpol

    Senior Member
    France - français
    je ne pense pas qu'il faille voir des sous-entendus subjectifs dans cette information purement objective
    "à l'extérieur" me semble inutile dès lors qu'on parle de Brest
    away ? raisonnablement. Brest est "au bout de la France", pas au bout du monde
     

    tHyK

    Member
    French - France
    They had an away win at Brest, ....they won away at Brest, ....xxxx, playing away from home, beat Brest
    It may be ugly, but it's absolutely standard journalese in sports reporting.
    Yes, that may be the point: it may be perfectly accepted in sports reporting, but not used anywhere else, so people who don't listen to sport journalism are not used to it (?).
    I myself think it's ugly too... though it is certainly concise (but obviously not too clear if there was a need for a thread about it...)
     
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